"I say slack off a little, in the interest of workers everywhere."

[Last Conformist]

How on earth does Ming have that many posts if he works productively 11h/day?

[Alexander's Horse]

Much of this slavery is self inflicted.

Its not hard to opt out if you really want to.

[Ming]

Originally posted by Bosh
I don't think there's anywhere near that much of a correlation. Especially with Free Riders etc. etc.

I'm with a small company... And I can see the "billable hours"

At the end of the year, we turn ALL profits over to the employees based on their contribution to our profit level... so our end of year bonus is based on how much money the company made during the year and our role in creating the profit.

I see a DIRECT correlation between the hours I work and my compensation

[Ted Striker]

Ming,

I'd say your situation is in the minority, and you're just plain lucky.

Most people don't work on billable hours.

[Ming]

Originally posted by Ted Striker
Ming,

I'd say your situation is in the minority, and you're just plain lucky.

Most people don't work on billable hours.

Lucky.... HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHA!
Since when is it "luck" to be smart enough to seek out a job that matches my work ethic and skills

While I may indeed be in the minority, any professional should be able to find a similar type situation if they look for it and then go get it. If you are good at what you do, and are in high demand, you can negotiate your terms BEFORE you accept the position. Most people make the mistake of not getting as much as they can before accepting a position, and then not getting it in writing

[Last Conformist]

Originally posted by Ming
At the end of the year, we turn ALL profits over to the employees based on their contribution to our profit level... so our end of year bonus is based on how much money the company made during the year and our role in creating the profit.

All profit? How deliciously non-capitalist of you.

[Ted Striker]

It is lucky.

I don't know any jobs other than very particular niche jobs that pay billable. Most people get base salary and that's it. Accountants for example, usually work really silly hours. Unless they are consultants, in which case they do get billable.


I don't know when the last time you looked for work is, but you probably have a special skill. You make it sound so easy for someone to just pick up their entire life situation and get a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow by just going out and calling a few places. That's just not the case.

Unless you're a stud like myself.

Regarding your profit sharing, well that's unique, most profit sharing I have seen either distributes the profit evenly to all employees or does it based on seniority.

[Ming]

Originally posted by Last Conformist
All profit? How deliciously non-capitalist of you.

Not really... Our company is set up in a different way than most companies. We are a "non-profit" corporation for tax reasons. It really works to our advantage. All profits are distributed at the end of the year based on your contribution to the overall bottom line... NOT just equally handed out... so we are indeed VERY capitalistic. You work hard, you get paid for your efforts. If you are a slacker, you get treated like one.

We are a small to midsized Ad Agency so each person is important. The hours you work... the results of your work... the revenue you produce... and the new clients you bring in are all figured into the equation when the profits are distributed. If we don't make a profit... No Bonus... so we have a very high incentive to do what we need to do to earn a profit by years end

It's a great way to run a business

[Ted Striker]

Ming is teh Commie!!!!!!!!!

[Flubber]

Originally posted by Ming



I see a DIRECT correlation between the hours I work and my compensation

Me too. While all profits don't go to employees, our old system was that the worker took 30% of all revenue actually received beyond salary plus overhead. If you brought in the business you would get even more.

The new system ignores revenues since junior associate complained about having to share the risk of bad debt writeoffs and instead we have moved to an hours based system. The model is that salary is based on billing so many hours and bonuses are paid at increments as you exceed that.

But no matter what, the model is that partners do take some of the upside in a profitable year. The flip side in a disaster year is that a partner can see their income drop a LOT but the associate never loses their base salary

[Ming]

Originally posted by Ted Striker
It is lucky.

I don't know any jobs other than very particular niche jobs that pay billable. Most people get base salary and that's it.

I don't get "paid" on billable hours... I get a base salary just like most people. However, my billable hours are tracked, and figure into end of year profit distribution/bonuses. Many other companies also hand out bonuses... we just do it different than some.

I don't know when the last time you looked for work is, but you probably have a special skill. You make it sound so easy for someone to just pick up their entire life situation and get a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow by just going out and calling a few places. That's just not the case.

It wasn't easy... I was out of work for 18 months. Fortunately, I had a great severance package so I could take my time looking for just the right job. I didn't settle for something just to find work. I didn't make "that mistake" Instead, a company that desperately need my skill set and I came to a negotiated agreement that met mine and their needs.

Regarding your profit sharing, well that's unique, most profit sharing I have seen either distributes the profit evenly to all employees or does it based on seniority.

Our actual profit sharing plan and 401K's are done as you suggest... money is added to our accounts based on a straight percentage of our base salaries.... It is only the remaining profit after that which is handed out based strickly on performance. This is done to reward those that have worked HARD to make the company profitable. It's a great way to run a business and stimulate your employees to provide their best efforts.

[Ming]

Originally posted by Ted Striker
you probably have a special skill.

I created that special skill on purpose so that I could take advantage of it.

There are MANY, MANY, MANY people that did what I did as a profession... and in the advertising industry, we see SERIOUS ups and downs... so to protect myself, I decided to specialize in a very specific area of the media world. Instead of doing consumer advertising, I focused on B2B advertising... it happens to be something I like, but many people don't. So when the advertising industry took it's hits, most of the guys doing what I do in the consumer field got trashed... with too many people for too few jobs. It's still a buyers market for ad agencies in this area. On the other hand, I'm now one of the leading experts in a smaller field which doesn't get effected as much by the overall economy. Not many people do what I do... a much better situation to be in.

But it wasn't luck... it was just a matter of looking at reality, and setting myself in a position to take advantage of it.

Many people don't do that... You should really take a look at how you can make yourself more marketable, and take the needed steps to do just that.

People should stop their whining and plan their careers to take advantage of what's available... assuming you are a capitalist

[Last Conformist]

Originally posted by Ming


Not really... Our company is set up in a different way than most companies. We are a "non-profit" corporation for tax reasons. It really works to our advantage. All profits are distributed at the end of the year based on your contribution to the overall bottom line... NOT just equally handed out... so we are indeed VERY capitalistic. You work hard, you get paid for your efforts. If you are a slacker, you get treated like one.

I have it on the authority of Nozick that reward on the basis of merit is non-capitalistic.

What's un-capitalistic is that the profits are handed out to the employees rather than accumulated for investment and expansion. Whether it's handed out on the basis of contribution, shoe size, or something else is immaterial.

[Ming]

Originally posted by Last Conformist

I have it on the authority of Nozick that reward on the basis of merit is non-capitalistic.

What's un-capitalistic is that the profits are handed out to the employees rather than accumulated for investment and expansion. Whether it's handed out on the basis of contribution, shoe size, or something else is immaterial.

We do our expansion and investment before the end of the year based on our cash flow at that time... and based on our companies overall objectives. Then we hand out what's left. And we aren't employees... we are all "owners" of the company. Just like in most companies.. the owners and stock holders are the ones that get the profits... just like we do

Totally Capitalistic

[Last Conformist]

Then not all profits are handed out to the employees.