Friends; when to intervine and when to mind your own business.

[Dinner]

A good friend of mine (a former college roommate who moved to San Diego and lives a block away), who happens to be Indian-American, is doing something I consider very foolhardy possibly even stupid. My question is should I say something and if so how should I bring the subject up or should I just keep my mouth shut.

Aman was born in India but moved to the US at age three so culturally he's American though his family remains very much a traditional Indian family with very traditional senses of family duty. He has a very successful career but nothing going on the lady friend front and his parents have taken to calling him up on a daily basis crying, ordering, and cajoling him to get married and have kids. His older sister basically up and moved across the country because they did that to her but Aman seems to not be willing to live his own life like his sister has done. Instead he feels bad when his mother calls crying and demanding he get married ASAP and give her grandkids. So he's under considerable family pressure to marry and marry quickly.

The problem is his only real girlfriend (also Indian but Americanized) broke up with him over differences concerning a woman's place in a family and the idea that the newly weds would have his parents move in with them. She wanted to live a western style life without in law running her house while Aman's parents very much want the traditional set up where the grandparents live with the eldest son and running the house so she bailed. Aman is a true friend of mine and I want him to be happy but he's gone on one of those Indian Matrimonial websites and is thinking about marrying a mail order bride from India. Not just thinking but really ready to do it and his parents are all for it.

He's been exchanging e-mails and pictures with this girl from India for two weeks now and he says he's going to fly out to India, meet this girl during a two week vacation, and if she's nice marry her a month or two afterwards. I was shocked when he told me and I tried to be sensitive but I told him marriage is the single most important thing you'll ever do in your life and you shouldn't just rush and marry someone you haven't even met just because your parents are playing emotional games to get you to marry. He accussed me of being culturally insensitive and said his parents had an arranged marriage so he thinks he could make one work even though he'd prefer a western style marriage for love.

I figured I had spoken my peace and I let the subject die but now he's left a message on my voice mail saying he wants to talk about it some more. Do any of you have an idea for a culturally sensitive but still straight forward way to approach this? I honestly think a mail order bride would be a bad choice especially since he'd be doing it to make his parents happy and not to make him happy but I recognize it is his life. Personally, I would tell my parents to **** off and mind their own business if they ever tried to pull anything this intrusive in my life but I am a western and our culture has a great deal of individualism. Ideas?

[Az]

**** "culturally sensitive" - you should simply start out any piece of advice you give with a disclamer that it's your opinion and yours only, and is given to them purely as friendly jesture because your really care about them. They can do with that advice whatever they want.

Then, spit the truth.

[pchang]

Wow - I have to agree with Az. In addition, I have seen two cases where Indian-American friends of mine went home to marry a girl (parents arrangement) and it completely blew up. On the other hand, I have seen 2 cases where it seems to be working out well. I'm pretty sure a 50% hit rate is worse than that the US as a whole. I have heard some people say the divorce rate in the US is 50%, but I don't think it is credible (and probably includes people who got married and divorced multiple times - like practically every celebrity).

[Az]

Wow - I have to agree with Az.

It's not as incredible as it seems at first.

[germanos]

his parents had an arranged marriage so he thinks he could make one work even though he'd prefer a western style marriage for love.

Tell him that this is exactly the choice he is facing.
Then tell him it is HE who will make the choice, not anybody else.

[chequita guevara]

Re: Friends; when to intervine and when to mind your own business.

Originally posted by Oerdin
[H]e's left a message on my voice mail saying he wants to talk about it some more.

This is the most important part, right here. That means he wants your input. So be his friend.

Some things to consider, he might be doing it because he wants to connect more to his culture, though as he's not letting his parents arrange the marriage, this is probably not the case.

He might be doing this out of desperation. Since his GF just broke up with him, he's on the rebound, and this is a bad time to make such decisions.

You should point out that as he's lived in America his whole life, he's very American, and may not be happy with someone who isn't more like him culturally.

There are serious difficulties in marrying a foreigner and trying to bring them to the U.S. He will likely also be expected to bring her family over to the U.S. as well (assuming he's a citizen).

He definately should not be doing this to make his parents happy. He should be worrying about making himself happy. If he's happy, his parents will be happy.

[:) Smiley]

Asian parents tend to be very wrong when it comes to relationships.

You absolutely need to step in and break the cycle.

[mrmitchell]

Ask him if hes ever seen a happy mail order bride relationship.

I haven't

[Rufus T. Firefly]

In Manila we issue probably 100+ visas every week to girls who've met their future husbands just as your friend has. So it's not just him; cyber-romance + brief meeting + fiance visa + marriage may be the wave of the future for lonely lads.

[Imran Siddiqui]

*****slap him .

Culturally insensitive was a unfair jab at you. Take Az's advice and just say its your opinion. You may not know his culture that well, but one thing you DO know is HIM. Play that up.

[Urban Ranger]

Depends on what he wants in a wife and a marriage.

If he himself wants kids than an Indian woman may be better. I am not sure how Westernised he is. Although he grew up in the US he lived with his parents, who should have some cultural influence on him.

[Ted Striker]

Since he asked you for your opinion, it's okay for you to give it to him.

After that, if he asks you to butt out, you need to respect that.. His parents already drove his sister away, so he may not appreciate someone else trying to tell him what the right thing is to do is.

I think you should tell him he needs to make HIMSELF happy first, not just with this girl, but with all things.

On the other hand, all the arranged marriages I have seen have worked out really well. But, I'm not Indian or Paki so my experience is limited.

I don't think Americans should claim to have any wisdom about what makes a marriage work, because, frankly, with a 50% divorce rate, WE SUCK AT IT.

[Dinner]

Originally posted by pchang
Wow - I have to agree with Az. In addition, I have seen two cases where Indian-American friends of mine went home to marry a girl (parents arrangement) and it completely blew up. On the other hand, I have seen 2 cases where it seems to be working out well. I'm pretty sure a 50% hit rate is worse than that the US as a whole. I have heard some people say the divorce rate in the US is 50%, but I don't think it is credible (and probably includes people who got married and divorced multiple times - like practically every celebrity).

The 50% divorce rate you hear about is mostly a fiction created by those "pro-family" organizations. I recall reading that the first time marriage divorce rate for couples after 20 years is only around 1/3. That's still way higher then a generation or two ago but no where near as bad as some groups claim. The second, third, or fourth marriages though have super high divorce rates but that makes sense since those people have a track record of not being able to make relationships work.

[Ted Striker]

Regarding the mail order bride thing, I don't have any problems with it.

The guys are getting women they would never be able to get in their own countries, and the women are getting men they would never be able to get in their own countries.

People will talk about financial exploitation or whatever, but this same thing goes on and has gone on in the USA and Europe all the time at the local level. Tell me what woman doesn't look at a man as a provider as an attractive quality? What man doesn't look at a beautiful woman as an attractive quality? You wanna see the poster child for mail order bride then check Anna Nicole Smith. Or go to any LA Lakers game and you'll find dudes in their 50s going out with SMOKING HOT women. I mean these girls are unbelievable, but you see them with these guys in their late 50s.

It's also disrespectful and bigoted toward certain groups of people. My coworker, for example, is a stud, and married a Russian girl he met at school. People kid him about, "was she a mail order bride," but that's not funny. It's the equivalent of calling gay people people "fags."

Of course, I don't know any of these couples personally, so I can't say how "successul" or not they are.

If they are happy together, it's nobody's business to judge them.


There was a time when personal ads were considered for losers, but now it's gone mainstream. I even took a look at them but the profiles all seem to be like "going to the club," with alot of emphasis on pop psychology/Comopolitan advice article superficialities, except it's just online. Hey, that's cool for people that like that, it's just not my thing.

One of my boys gets on AOL and scores alot with it. Not my thing either but he's happy with it. He was with the same girl for 10 years who treated him like crap, and didn't think he could find other girls, but he's literally with a different girl every week!

[notyoueither]

Ask him which culture he wants his daughters to grow up in.