American Arrogance Rooted in Christian Beliefs

[Sikander]

Originally posted by aneeshm


No , but I assert that Christian dogma is structured such that , to stay true to it , adherents will have to be violent , in one way or the other .

Just like Jesus.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by aneeshm
I'm serious .

Sure you are.

[Jon Miller]

Originally posted by aneeshm


Then it seems that Christian missionaries are pretty damn desperate to share . And that sharing has taken some rather unpleasant forms .

I am not saying all are like that

there sure are some Christian missionaries, who do not act very Christian..

ones who view things differently, or who want power or something

here in the states, most Christians don't want to share their faith

same is true in Europe

Jon Miller

[Ogie Oglethorpe]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
Troll thread. It's wise to treat it as such. Though I will grant that aneeshm seems to be better at the art than Ted.

Aaaahhhh the old damning with very faint praise ploy.

Strike that its not even really a compliment considering the comparator.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Sikander
Just like Jesus.

Jesus was no Christian. He was a Jew. His religion was Judaism.

[Ogie Oglethorpe]

Originally posted by loinburger

Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe
Aneeshm is not so much intolerant because he feels that Christiainty is wrong but moreover is intolerant b/c he is unwilling to allow that Christians have the right to feel sure of their own belief system without incurring his hatred.

quote:
Originally posted by aneeshm
I attack Christianity as long as it claims to be the only true way , but I leave Christians alone. I do not judge people on the basis of their religion.

Yes and thank you for crystalizing my point. He attacks Christianity but leaves people alone. Hmmm.... how does one do that I wonder?

What if I were to attack homosexuals, but I leave homsexual individuals alone? Does that imply tolerance? I think not.

[Ogie Oglethorpe]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara


Jesus was no Christian. He was a Jew. His religion was Judaism.

Not really, nonbeliever. He is the originator of a brand new religion as soon as he started preaching that he was The Way.

[chequita guevara]

Love the Christian. Hate the Bigotry.

[Proteus_MST]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara

Jesus was no Christian. He was a Jew. His religion was Judaism.

But as stated by me before,
there is not one church of christ (although some people within the the RCC might think different ) but many and not all share the dark past of the RCC.
There might be enough churches (maybe the orthodox church for example) which weren´t keen on converting heathen by fire, sword and conquest.

(But I agree, that the thing founded by christ was (at his time) just another jewish sect (maybe even meant to be "only" such a thing) and only later, by the work of his followers, became a church of its own)

[Heresson]

Originally posted by aneeshm
Is the mind of the devout Christian such that it cannot even think of power without abusing it , that it cannot even imagine a religion which is peaceful , that it cannot concieve of a religious tradition which can be peaceful and powerful at the same time ?

I believe power is always abused, nevermind if those in power are Christian, Hindu, Muslim or atheist. Religion may influence it, but not change it completely. Had the Hindu conquered China, Middle East and/or Europe and hadn't promoted their religion there by use of their power, You could claim Hinduism in history had some advantages over other religions in this respect

Have you any idea of Hindu strength when it was at its peak ? The world is lucky that Hinduism is not expansionist , for there have been three times in human history when Hinduism could have , had it wanted to , rampaged its way across Asia ( as two other religions ( namely Islam and Christianity ) dis ) , without meeting credible resistance .

Tell me more about it. When, how, and what proof fo You have it could've happened.

Let me correct that . They suffered from suspicious cases of Sudden Infant Death Syndrome - the founders died of mysterious causes . Have you forgotten the inquisition ?

By the time inquisition was founded, most of Europe was already Christian. Also, inquisition was not directed against allien religions, but against heretics (except for the case someone converted to judaism). As You can see, there are many branches of Christianity, many heresies alive today. Not that the church, and especially the secular power, didn't want to supress them.

And what happened if a common perosn defied the wish of his ruler WRT religion - that's right , he was executed .

Proof?
I know that after embracing Christianity, Polish prince Mieszko ordered breaking teeth of people who do not fast, doing harm to testicles of those who betray their wives etc, but I do not know anything about killing people. They did not care about if You believed in Christianity or not, but if You behaved like a pius Christian of those times.

And you yourself admit that after the 4th century , conversiosn were forcible . The fact that Justinian had pagans in court is irrelevant - what matters is that conversion was foricible .

Actually, it was more complicated. They didn't force people to be Christian, but first limited, and later banned pagan cult.

And the bolded sentence indicates that you are fine with the use of force to convert pagans .

If the pagans were not allowing peaceful missions, and were persecuting Christians among them, I think attack on them is partially justified

Sikhism was the fightimg arm of Hinduism ( many of whose founders were killed by Islamic rulers , according to Islamic law ) . It was born as a reaction to Islam , in order that Islam's tyranny may be thrown out of India .

Doesn't it embrace part of Muslim teachings?

No , my Christian friend , it never was , is not , and never will be .

Why are Christians persecuted in India today, then?

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Heresson
Why are Christians persecuted in India today, then?

It's probably the hassling all the people at airports for donations.

[Heresson]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara


Jesus was no Christian. He was a Jew. His religion was Judaism.

Just like Martin Luther's denomination was catholicism


I know there are some differences, and that in the times of Jesus, Christianity was not fully separated from Judaism, but history of Christianity starts with Jesus, just like history of lutheran reformation starts in 1517, not when Luther finally revolted against the souvereignity of Rome.

[Heresson]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara


It's probably the hassling all the people at airports for donations.

No. It's forcible conversions to Hinduism, forbiding converting to Christianity, attacks on churches, raping nuns, and denying social aid to Christians sometimes.
Of course, these actions are taken by individuals, specific parties and local authorities, not by India as a whole, but still.

[loinburger]

Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe
Yes and thank you for crystalizing my point. He attacks Christianity but leaves people alone. Hmmm.... how does one do that I wonder?

What if I were to attack homosexuals, but I leave homsexual individuals alone? Does that imply tolerance? I think not.

So "having a discourse" on something is tolerance, and "attacking" something is intolerance? This would mean that it is only possible for two people to "have a discourse" on a subject if they are already in agreement -- otherwise they'd be "attacking" each other's opinions/beliefs.

[Jon Miller]

I agree with loinburger

JM