If your country were to become communist...

[Verres]

Originally posted by Kidicious
Paying people not to do something? That's not communism.

That isn't what I said.

Making a country an appealing place to live in shouldn't involve bribing the inhabitants, and that is never something I would advocate.

[chequita guevara]

So, let them emigrate and pay remittances, use those remittances to build up the country.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Verres


That isn't what I said.

Making a country an appealing place to live in shouldn't involve bribing the inhabitants, and that is never something I would advocate.

Oh ok. But still I see the problem as losing the most talented intelligent people. People who could earn 6 figure incomes. It's pretty hard to keep those people by reducing crime and stuff like that.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
So, let them emigrate and pay remittances, use those remittances to build up the country.

You need skilled people to build up a country, not just money.

[Verres]

Originally posted by Kidicious


Oh ok. But still I see the problem as losing the most talented intelligent people. People who could earn 6 figure incomes. It's pretty hard to keep those people by reducing crime and stuff like that.

I do not believe a communist country would automatically lose the most talented and intelligent. Those chasing money at the expense of everything else may leave, but I doubt they are necessarily the most talented and intelligent. In fact, they may be considered less so on the grounds they are so single minded and care for nothing outside their wages.

I'm not saying the rich are stupid - they *usually* have to have brains to have got into a position of wealth and power. I am just pointing out that earnings do not always reflect intelligence or 'usefulness' to society.

[OzzyKP]

Originally posted by Dr Zoidberg
Not true, there is nothing in communism that opposes private property. You can own your house, or your car or your summer cottage. After all the wealth is distributed equally, it´s up to you what you do with it.

Hmmm, that doesn't sound like a society of this sort would remain communist for long. A one time redistribution and then leaving people alone would just allow those people to turn into filthy capitalists as they begin to buy, sell, and trade property on their own.

Ok, lets say everyone has a house, a car and a summer cottage in this communist society. We all own them. Since we own them we are free to sell them, rent them out, fix them up, or do whatever we want with them, right? Do you see how that could lead to amassed capital?

Your retort may be that since everyone has a house, car, and summer cottage why would they buy mine? Ah well that assumes perfect equality, and even hardcore Communists must admit that perfect equality is impossible due to limited resources. Lets say this is the United Socialist States of America, USSA, and lets say the best spot to have a summer cottage is Lake Tahoe and Key West. Out of the 300 million people in the country, how many of these good Communists will get a summer cottage on Lake Tahoe or Key West? Very few. So some will be stuck with a summer cottage in New Jersey, or Mississippi, or heck, Kansas.

So that creates inequality, and thus a motive to buy/sell/rent/renovate/advance. So the guy with a summer cottage in Key West decides he isn't all that much for vacationing anyhow, so he decides to rent it out by the week to those poor schmucks who were stuck with cottages in New Jersey and Kansas, and eventually gets quite a good amount of money. Buys homes from others, fixes them up, rents them out, etc etc.

Capitalism is reborn.

So private property is incompatable with true communism. Unless you mean the person "owns" their house, but if they decide to sell it or rent it the transaction has a 90% tax put on it. Well... sure. Even then someone would find a way no doubt. Or if you mean they "own" it but can't buy, sell, rent, or renovate it, well....uh-huh.

[OzzyKP]

And with the paying the cost of education thing, that's an interesting, but weird idea. The US provides "free" (at taxpayer expense) education K-12th grade, but if someone moves out of their school district, state, or even country no payment is required. Nor is reimbursement required for their use of the police, fire, roads, military, or anything else. I think its a silly idea.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Verres


I do not believe a communist country would automatically lose the most talented and intelligent. Those chasing money at the expense of everything else may leave, but I doubt they are necessarily the most talented and intelligent. In fact, they may be considered less so on the grounds they are so single minded and care for nothing outside their wages.

I'm not saying the rich are stupid - they *usually* have to have brains to have got into a position of wealth and power. I am just pointing out that earnings do not always reflect intelligence or 'usefulness' to society.

wages in a free market identify the level of scarcity of that particular skilled worker. I don't want to say that higher paying jobs are more useful to society because it's a matter of having the right amount of trained labor for every field, but you can't go losing people who are talented for particular work that can recieve much higher compensation in other countries when you already have a shortage for that type of skilled worker in your own country.

And talent and desire for wealth are not connected at all.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by OzzyKP
Ok, lets say everyone has a house, a car and a summer cottage in this communist society. We all own them. Since we own them we are free to sell them, rent them out, fix them up, or do whatever we want with them, right? Do you see how that could lead to amassed capital?

Who said anything about letting people rent out houses or even owning two?

[Az]

Lots of people owned two houses in the SU.

[Kidlicious]

SU wasn't the model communist society. It was one big **** up if you ask me.

[Thue]

Re: If your country were to become communist...

Originally posted by Lancer
...and bright young people were to be college educated by the state, should they be allowed to emmigrate so that they might persue carreers under a system that allows them to become wealthy?

If not, should they not be allowed to travel?

In Denmark the state pays for university edication; including mine. No travelling or emigration restrictions have been put in place...

[Spiffor]

What is the problem with owning two houses?

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Spiffor
What is the problem with owning two houses?

Why would you need two houses?

[Verres]

One for yourself and family, one for your mistress and illegitimate children.