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Originally posted by Urban Ranger
IIRC, the winner goes straight to the finals week.
Not anymore.
“I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
- John 13:34-35 (NRSV)
Just as at France 98 and Korea/Japan in 2002, 32 teams will take part in Germany 2006. Germany qualify automatically as hosts, but the holders (Brazil) now have to qualify in the normal way.
“I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
- John 13:34-35 (NRSV)
Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Nope. The winners of the World Cup don't get in free anymore. And they shouldn't, neither should the CL winner. If you win the tournament, all that you've earned is the CL championship, not a chance to win it again the next year.
In US sports, at least, if you win the championship one year, you don't automatically get to the playoffs the next. You have to earn your spot every year, within the league structure.
Just because thats the way it is in US sports doesnt mean its right
Its not just about winning the tournament, its about winning the right to be there next year, plus I want to see the best teams, the biggest matches, I want to see the holders, not some sh1tpot team in their place for diversitys sake.
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I reckon it is the better arrangement from the commercial PoV. More matches - more income.
(\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
(='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
(")_(") "Starting the fire from within."
Even when Brazil didnt have to qualify they played plenty of friendlies in International weeks, if only to get the squad together. Of course US teams dont play friendlies in the middle of a season, so the commercial PoV makes perfect sense. Not necessarily right, money comes first.
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Originally posted by Maquiladora
Just because thats the way it is in US sports doesnt mean its right
Its not just about winning the tournament, its about winning the right to be there next year, plus I want to see the best teams, the biggest matches, I want to see the holders, not some sh1tpot team in their place for diversitys sake.
No, it's not about winning the right to be there next year. It's about winning the trophy. If you want to be there next year, you get in the top 4, that simple. If you can't make the top 4, then you don't deserve to defend your title. That simple.
“I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
- John 13:34-35 (NRSV)
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing?
Then why call him God? - Epicurus
Originally posted by alva
Dammit, another crap country goes through.
It's a bit hard for a "crap" country to sneak through a round robin match scheme. OTOH, eliminations are different.
(\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
(='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
(")_(") "Starting the fire from within."
Originally posted by Urban Ranger
It's a bit hard for a "crap" country to sneak through a round robin match scheme. OTOH, eliminations are different.
Indeed... and it is a 'European' Cup. We want all of Europe to participate, and engaging in such a competition may make those 'crap' countries that much better with all the experience on the continent.
“I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
- John 13:34-35 (NRSV)
Originally posted by Maquiladora
What the ****? The holders dont get in? More UEFA bull****, they dont know how to run football. Next theyll be telling us we have to use multI-ball.
FA bull****, not UEFA bull****. The UEFA would like to have Liverpool in as well but it's an FA decision to make. But the UEFA can't just abandon it's own rules. If they do, I demand AZ gets a rematch against Sporting as well: they only went out on away goals scored in extra time, I don't think that's a fair rule either: Sporting got 30 minutes more than AZ in which their away goals counted double. Away goals in extra time IMO should never be counted double...
Everyone, including the FA, Liverpool and Everton (and AZ for that matter) knew the rules at the start of the season. If they didn't like it, they shouldn't have accepted them then. It's not like this situation with Liverpool never happened before so that the teams might not have realised that this was a possibility: it happened just a few years ago. It's too damn late to start whining now...
But as far as changing the rules goes (either for now or the future), I don't think that the number 5 of ANY European competition should be allowed in the Champions League. It's called the Champions League after all. If you're not in the top four of your domestic league, you can't possibly be regarded a champion (heck, I don't think the numbers 3 and 4 deserve to be in either, I strongly prefer the old system when only national league winners were allowed). Even if you do win the CL, because crap teams win elimination tournaments all the time. Look at Euro 2004. Hell, the UEFA Cup featured a 2rd division German team this year because they had won the national cup -- and that wasn't a first either. Millwall was in the FA Cup final last year too...
they only went out on away goals scored in extra time, I don't think that's a fair rule either: Sporting got 30 minutes more than AZ in which their away goals counted double.
AZ also got 30 minutes more in its home stadium
[/nitpick]
But as far as changing the rules goes (either for now or the future), I don't think that the number 5 of ANY European competition should be allowed in the Champions League. It's called the Champions League after all. If you're not in the top four of your domestic league, you can't possibly be regarded a champion (heck, I don't think the numbers 3 and 4 deserve to be in either, I strongly prefer the old system when only national league winners were allowed). Even if you do win the CL, because crap teams win elimination tournaments all the time. Look at Euro 2004. Hell, the UEFA Cup featured a 2rd division German team this year because they had won the national cup -- and that wasn't a first either. Millwall was in the FA Cup final last year too...
Total agreement with everything in that last paragraph.
“I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
- John 13:34-35 (NRSV)
Originally posted by Locutus
FA bull****, not UEFA bull****. The UEFA would like to have Liverpool in as well but it's an FA decision to make. But the UEFA can't just abandon it's own rules. If they do, I demand AZ gets a rematch against Sporting as well: they only went out on away goals scored in extra time, I don't think that's a fair rule either: Sporting got 30 minutes more than AZ in which their away goals counted double. Away goals in extra time IMO should never be counted double...
Everyone, including the FA, Liverpool and Everton (and AZ for that matter) knew the rules at the start of the season. If they didn't like it, they shouldn't have accepted them then. It's not like this situation with Liverpool never happened before so that the teams might not have realised that this was a possibility: it happened just a few years ago. It's too damn late to start whining now...
So why were you just whining about AZ?
But as far as changing the rules goes (either for now or the future), I don't think that the number 5 of ANY European competition should be allowed in the Champions League. It's called the Champions League after all. If you're not in the top four of your domestic league, you can't possibly be regarded a champion (heck, I don't think the numbers 3 and 4 deserve to be in either, I strongly prefer the old system when only national league winners were allowed). Even if you do win the CL, because crap teams win elimination tournaments all the time. Look at Euro 2004. Hell, the UEFA Cup featured a 2rd division German team this year because they had won the national cup -- and that wasn't a first either. Millwall was in the FA Cup final last year too...
Id prefer only the Champions of each league in the CL too, but thats not many matches, which means its not gonna happen in the near future.
On the other hand why make it easier for crap teams to win a major European competition?
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On the other hand why make it easier for crap teams to win a major European competition?
Raise your hand, anyone, that expected Liverpool to even get this far in the CL?
Btw, its a European Champions League, that implies that more than a few European countries are involved. Like the World Cup demands teams from every part of the world. If you just want the English, French, Spanish, Italian, and German League, why don't you make you own and call it the "**** You Cup"?
“I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
- John 13:34-35 (NRSV)
On the other hand why make it easier for crap teams to win a major European competition?
Raise your hand, anyone, that expected Liverpool to even get this far in the CL?
Btw, its a European Champions League, that implies that more than a few European countries are involved. Like the World Cup demands teams from every part of the world. If you just want the English, French, Spanish, Italian, and German League, why don't you make you own and call it the "**** You Cup"?
It also says "Champions" and "League", but neither of those are completely true either.
But my point was doubt over making it a purely knockout tournament again, since this is a lot less likely to out the best team.
Call to Power 2: Apolyton Edition - download the latest version (12th June 2011)
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Do you actually think that Liverpool is one of the two best teams in Europe this year? They played well in the tourney, but Chelsea finished 30+ points above them in the Premiership!
If you want the best, just take the Champions and have 'em face off. You can't compare Champions from one country to those of another unless they play against each other, but you can compare teams in the same league, because they play the same competition, as well as against each other.
“I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
- John 13:34-35 (NRSV)
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