Apostates of Islam

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by Jaguar

Erm, didn't he have sex with her when she was like 12, though?

Mary was probably only in her early teens when God ****ed her...

[Last Conformist]

Originally posted by Jaguar
I'm an Atheist whose parents are Jews, and oddly, I dislike Islam and Christianity far more.

I don't think that's odd at all. I'm an atheist whose parents are Christians, and I find Christianity much less disagreeable than Islam, on the whole. Same for plenty of people I know.

I do not deign to have much of an opinion on Judaicism.

[Jaguar]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse


Mary was probably only in her early teens when God ****ed her...

God having sex with teenage girls is hot.

[Az]

God having sex with teenage girls is hot.

Perfect fanfiction material.



Anyway,

people who leave religion and diss it after that

[Imran Siddiqui]

At least in mainline (nonfundimentalist) Protestant groups great pains are taken to say that pre-Jesus Jewish teachings were flawed and thus Jesus needed to be sent to put people back on the right track.

Does the Bible itself say that part of it can be ignored? It's a cop-out to say that Protestant groups say parts of the Old Testament can be ignored. The book itself doesn't say that.

Read your Koran and see how apostates, nonbelievers, and women are treated.

Hmmm, Christianity in the 700s allowed non-believers to flourish within their walls? Funny, because that's when I thought the roots of Christian anti-semitism were being built. And women were treated nicely in other parts of the world at the time as well? Wow... didn't know that women were equals to men in China around the same time. Fact of the matter is that Islam gave women more rights than any other Eurasian society at the time (perhaps some Native American tribes gave them more, but I can't be sure).

Logic says he probably had sex with his wife.

Frankly, your arguments are more on the basis of emotion than any logical basis. This whole deluded belief that our morality should apply to the past, for one.

I think I have a pretty good view of the culture. I just see it for what it is. Barbaric.

And if you said that back in 1200, you'd be laughed out of the city. If the religious was so barbaric, why was it the center of cultural and scientific advances in the late Middle Ages? Are you going to (predictably) argue that that was not due to Islam? If it was so inherantly barbaric, why was it not considered so during that time period? Maybe because it doesn't fit into your little fallacy that the culture that invented algebra could be considered barbaric?

[Last Conformist]

Well, the Islamic lands weren't the center of cultural and scientific advances in the late middle ages.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Oerdin


As usual nothing but snide comments and nothing of value being contributed. At least you are consistant.

I rise to the level a given thread deserves and a thread based entirely on religious bigotry and an extremely shallow view of a given culture doesn't really deserve all that much.

However, in a desire to raise the level of discourse beyond your inane rantings I found an interesting article: Nothing Islamic about human sacrifice

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by Last Conformist
Well, the Islamic lands weren't the center of cultural and scientific advances in the late middle ages.

Um... compared to Europe they were... unless you are saying China was the center of those advances in that era? That's arguable.

[Last Conformist]

The late middle ages in Europe saw alot of cultural and scientific/technological advances. I'm hard pressed to think of any from the Islamic world.

[Heresson]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse


Mary was probably only in her early teens when God ****ed her...

Bad joke. There was no sex in it. Mary remained virgin.

The late middle ages in Europe saw alot of cultural and scientific/technological advances. I'm hard pressed to think of any from the Islamic world.

astrolab or whatever.

[Jon Miller]

as far as it went, european kings were getting married even earlier than that (like pre6) in the middle ages at times...

Jon Miller

[pchang]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui


Um... compared to Europe they were... unless you are saying China was the center of those advances in that era? That's arguable.

Umm no. China pwned the rest of the world at that time in culture. Also, advanced technology and barbarism are not mutually exclusive. See WWII.

[Pekka]

I would still claim the only problem is fundamentalism, period.

Because they tend to intervene other people's lives. There is a little backwards knot, that for example Christians (fundies) think they are right, and bible says that a good Christian spreads the word. So far, bible isn't disagreeing. But where does it say, that you are supposed to threaten people with hell, shout at them, threaten them and what ever. It doesnt' say that. Or if it says, maybe it's one of them teachings better left undone. Like stoning people.

The problem is, fundies CHOOSE the parts they will follow, and disregard the ones they don't like, that are too liberal for their taste. Like the one where you are supposed to be tolerant and stuff. Live and let live. Who the hell thinks Jesus was 'conservative Christian' ???? Is that a nice way to say you believe others will burn in hell and you will be racist against them for your life on earth? I would like to understand the logic where God actually likes the idea of a fundie going and trashing other folks.

THIS is a problem. Tolerant people, Christians, Muslims, Jewish people around the world let the fundies do what they do, and everyone else do what they do, but fundies just have to stick their noses on everyone elses business. Because they are being good Christians. Well, how about stop being aggressive judgemental bastard for starters, and be that good Christian and promote the religion with sense of reasonability?

Example: Terrorists blows up stuff. People in Palestine gather to streets to dance. Disgusting. Because westerners have oppressed Palestine so long, it's ok to joy their death by dancing on the streets? Sounds extreme to me. You tell me those dancing folks are reasonable, and tolerant?

The flip side: Many of us Christians not going to streets to dance but getting satisfaction and righteous feeling when stuff gets blown up in Islamic countries. ****, that's reasonable? The difference is, there was no dancing, but how much does it REALLY differ? It doesn't differ at all.

These people are fundies, because they are not tolerant. They don't accept other people who are different. That's not very Christian. That's going against the main teachings, but fundies choosed to 'spread the word'. They don't even realize how freaking stupid that sounds, and how utterly dangerous that is. They are doing God's work and going to heaven and saving people. Yeah doing what? being obnoxious and directly having influence on deaths of other people?

That's the problem. The lack of tolerance. Between any religion, but mostly between Muslims and Christians. You don't often see Hindus waiving the war flag on other religions. And fundies think they are the best of people in God's eyes, which is totally weird, I mean they are the root of many problems, that wouldn't be here if it wasn't for their hate mongering, because they do hate, and that's the fuel in their fire.

[Heresson]

Does the Bible itself say that part of it can be ignored? It's a cop-out to say that Protestant groups say parts of the Old Testament can be ignored. The book itself doesn't say that.

Read Bible. Jesus says that. He says for example You don't have to fast in sabat.

Read your Koran and see how apostates, nonbelievers, and women are treated.

Hmmm, Christianity in the 700s allowed non-believers to flourish within their walls? Funny, because that's when I thought the roots of Christian anti-semitism were being built. And women were treated nicely in other parts of the world at the time as well? Wow... didn't know that women were equals to men in China around the same time. Fact of the matter is that Islam gave women more rights than any other Eurasian society at the time (perhaps some Native American tribes gave them more, but I can't be sure).

Weak argument.
The behaviour of VIIIth century Christians is of no relevance to modern Christianity, while Al-Qur'an and Muhammad are the basis of Muslim beliefs.

Frankly, your arguments are more on the basis of emotion than any logical basis. This whole deluded belief that our morality should apply to the past, for one.

It's a deluded belief of all messianic religions. God's right do not change. You have the same religious duties as hungreds of years ago.

And if you said that back in 1200, you'd be laughed out of the city. If the religious was so barbaric, why was it the center of cultural and scientific advances in the late Middle Ages? Are you going to (predictably) argue that that was not due to Islam? If it was so inherantly barbaric, why was it not considered so during that time period? Maybe because it doesn't fit into your little fallacy that the culture that invented algebra could be considered barbaric?

In late Middle Ages Muslim world was already in cultural decline mostly.
And no, algebra was not invented thanks to Islam. Islam didn't stop inventing it, though.
But of course it's worth to say that nearly all Arab linguistic and literature studies originated from islamic studies.
In comparison to the surrounding, Muslim world 650-1300 lets say was a fourishing one and definitely can not be called barbaric - not more than any other civ of the era.

[Heresson]

Originally posted by Jon Miller
as far as it went, european kings were getting married even earlier than that (like pre6) in the middle ages at times...

Jon Miller

You could make an arrangement, or even a marriage, but full marriage was allowed sth like 12 for girls and 14 for boys.
But these kings are not examples for us in every detail of their lifes, and Muhammad is for Muslims