Rugby - Hands Off, Wattle!

[finbar]

Okay, here's the whole list:

Backs:

I Balshaw (England)
G Murphy (Ireland)
J Robinson (England)
G Thomas (Wales)
S Williams (Wales)
J Lewsey (England)
S Horgan (Ireland)
D Hickie (Ireland),
T Shanklin (Wales)
B O'Driscoll (Ireland, capt)
G Henson (Wales)
O Smith (England)
G D'Arcy (Ireland)
W Greenwood (England)
S Jones (Wales)
R O'Gara (Ireland)
C Hodgson (England)
M Dawson (England)
D Peel (Wales)
G Cooper (Wales
C Cusiter (Scotland).


Forwards:

G Rowntree (England)
A Sheridan (England)
M Stevens (England)
G Jenkins (Wales)
J White (England)
J Hayes (Ireland)
G Bulloch (Scotland)
S Thompson (England)
A Titterrell (England)
S Byrne (Ireland)
D Grewcock (England)
B Kay (England)
M O'Kelly (Ireland)
D O'Callaghan (Ireland)
P O'Connell (Ireland)
M Owen (Wales)
R Hill (England)
N Back (England),
M Williams (Wales)
L Moody (England)
S Taylor (Scotland)
M Corry (England)
L Dallaglio (England)

Jonny Wilkinson appears to have played at least 30 seconds of rugby this week without breaking down, so you can certainly add his name to the list.

[finbar]

Talk about a weekend of misadventure:

J**** - yellow card
Corry - red card

On the way to a loss.

George Gregan - broken leg

On the way to a loss.

[Alexander's Horse]

The emerging issue, if not scandal, down here in Canberra is what exactly was the local rugby board doing last year sacking a coach who took the Brumbies to the top and replacing him with a local man who has now lost 4 in a row.

The gossip is that appointment everything to do with mates in high places, including senior players and local club officials/rivalries, and little to do with coaching ability.

To make matters worse, this is the first time the Waratahs have beaten the Brumbies in Canberra. Canberrans are mortified. We had special reasons to be proud NSW had never won here, especially because of perceived discrimination against the ACT by NSW on other matters.

[finbar]

Stupid double post! Stupid software!

[finbar]

Originally posted by Alexander's Horse
The emerging issue, if not scandal, down here in Canberra is what exactly was the local rugby board doing last year sacking a coach who took the Brumbies to the top and replacing him with a local man who has now lost 4 in a row.

The gossip is that appointment everything to do with mates in high places, including senior players and local club officials/rivalries, and little to do with coaching ability.

To make matters worse, this is the first time the Waratahs have beaten the Brumbies in Canberra. Canberrans are mortified. We had special reasons to be proud NSW had never won here, especially because of perceived discrimination against the ACT by NSW on other matters.

Emerging issue? It was widely known last season, well before David Nucifora was told his contract wouldn't be renewed, that he was for the chop. And that his demise was almost entirely player-driven. Senior players - Joe Roff, who promptly retired anyway; Owen Finegan; Stirling Mortlock; Jeremy Paul; and possibly George Gregan - resented Nucifora's coaching style in that he actually coached them, including devising tactics. The senior players thought they didn't need coaching, that their success was largely their own doing, including devising their own tactics. Of course it was crap.

Their attitude had its genesis in the franchise's culture - developed by Rod McQueen and maintained by Eddie Jones - which empowered the players. They were given vastly more power and responsibility than in any other club. But they were always coached, whether they realised it or not. The problem with empowering already massive egos is that the egos can get out of control. Which is what happened when the players decided they didn't want Nucifora.

It's hard to know how good or bad a job Laurie Fisher is doing this year because the team has been murdered by injuries. They've never had more than two of their established backline start a match. They would have lost games last season if they'd had the same injury toll. The worry against the Waratahs on the weekend, however, was that, regardless of the injuries, the Brumbies couldn't counter a very basic, very effective Waratah game plan - kicking deep into touch to keep the Brumbies in their own half, utilise a superior lineout, and employ a killer midfield defence. They were comprehensively out-strategised by the Waratahs. That was the big worry.

[Alexander's Horse]

yeah that all gels with what I know - the emerging aspect is the team is losing and Canberra is not a very forgiving place to say the least when its team is losing so rightly or wrongly Laurie Fisher's job is going to be on the line and all the stuff you mention is going to get dredged up

ABC grandstand on saturday is going to be pretty interesting - might even ring up myself

[Havak]

Gregan broke his leg? Sorry to hear that.

More on Tigers card collection later.

He knocked up kicking penalties and conversions against you last June!

Not sure what your point is there as he faced off against Hodgson – and that doesn’t excite me either.

I thought he was struggling, even if his effort in the final was better than his efforts earlier in the tournament.

Perspective I guess – he certainly didn’t lose out to the two young bucks on the Aussie side. And as you know I rate pug face very highly so to me Backy had a cracking game.

But I guess we will see will we not? McCaw has been praised to the rafters for several years – if Backy was struggling in 2003 Richie should blow him away. But he won’t IMO (not least because I think Backy is probably a bench prospect!).

It was the match where J**** cuffed, from memory, Lewsey around the ear.

That was one of the European games against Wasps.

Interestingly, Umaga played 12 twice, and Mauger once.

Hmm – Graham Henry does like to mix and match?

He can say it now, safe in the knowledge that it won't happen again.

If he saw yesterdays game he will be very happy about that – vintage Jonno (yellow card for not stepping back yet again).

I read about it. The Welsh were playing silly games. Came back to bite them.

As it was always going to. Hard to feel any sympathy for the Welsh at the best of times.

1664 is not beer. It's what you drink when you can't get Guinness.

I’ve always found Guinness a bit of a gamble on the continent to be honest. And I don’t mind drinking premium lagers like 1664 when on tour – after all I know I will be coming home to Real Ale sooner or later.

I see Finbar trawled up the list for you. And I hope the concussion is better now?

One addendum to the list – Balshaw knackered a quad in Leeds enjoyable cup win over Baaarrfff and may be out of Lions running (which may open a door for Patterson or Morgan).

Okay something to get off my chest – Saracens are an easy club to dislike these days. We lost to them yesterday after they ran out to box rather than play rugby. We lost Martin Corry on 23 minutes to a straight red. He was pulled down in a maul by Richard Hill and swung his elbow as he went down nearly smashing Hill’s eye socket. It was reckless, it was silly and I just can’t defend it.

The problem for me is that Chris White let Sarries illegally spoil all game and did nothing about it. When he finally lost all control and Martin took matters into his own hands he then yellow carded both Jonno and the prat who had been winding him up! A poor game by Whitey – and the plaudits being give to Sarries mystified me – Tigers played with 14 men for sixty minutes and only lost because of a very dubious penalty late on. Sarries just are not a good side – no wonder their game plan is all niggle (and it is very easy to tell their coach used to be a Sale man – typical Manx game plan of going the biff).

So we are now tied on 73 points with Dayglo’s mob with one game left – Wasps at Welford Road. Do or die stuff – we must win it. You see despite the fact our points difference is +300 or so, 150 odd better than Wasps, they have gone above us on games won – 15 to our 14. All the draws this season have come back to haunt us.

And it’s our traditional preparation for big European games – losing a banker league fixture that is.

Toulouse must be laughing in their cereal this morning – a wounded Tiger awaits them on Sunday.

[finbar]

Originally posted by Havak
Gregan broke his leg? Sorry to hear that.

Broken fibula, which isn't the worst sort of break, apparently. Collided with Waratahs' Chris Whitaker trying to collect a loose ball. Four to six weeks. But it's the last thing the Brumbies needed.

Not sure what your point is there as he faced off against Hodgson – and that doesn’t excite me either.

Simple point really - he can kick straight.

Okay something to get off my chest –

I was looking forward to it. And you didn't disappoint!

[ravagon]

Morning all,

Got back from an 'unexpected' vacation yesterday and sat down to work out what'd happened while I was away ..

(a) The Blues are doing a lot better.

(b) The Welsh actually won the slam. (although I see the resident Welshies have already put someone to the sword over that one. )
I would break into a rendition of the Welsh anthem but it's still far too early in the flu season to have built up the amount of phlegm required.

(c) There's going to be a Leicester-Toulouse semi.
Something else I was rather looking forward to (In the words of one of the famous orators of out time 'The winner will be showered with praise. The loser will be booed until my throat is sore.').

(d) I have more work to do now than I had when I left, and, thanks to an unnamed 'hiccup', much less time in which to do it.

(e) Some utter ******* has turned my beloved PC into a workstation, albeit temporarily. :utter fury:


This brings up the rather revolting conclusion that time off rugby=good and time off work=bad!

To top it all off an English colleague dubbed me an 'honorary Englishman', from which I can only infer that Havak has been sticking those signs on my back again!


Looks as though last weekend was quite the talking point ...

I take it that that Henjak chap is now in for Greegan?
Apparently the Brumbies reserves were being targetted by the new Perth franchise as well as the hapless Reds, no idea if Henjak were included here or not (there was talk of the Brumbies reserves being 'decimated' - I know how finbar loves the word. ), but actually getting the chance to play the full 80m for a few games for a change may give him the incentive to stay?

It looks as though Jake White is beginning to throw some weight around - RSA S12 sides are now coming under a bit of pressure to rest some of their Bok players in time for the upcoming 3N and International season. Only the Cats so far (and it may not have made a great deal of difference in the S12 standings or for their upcoming clash with the Crusaders I admit) but the other clubs may not be far behind.
Not a happy sign for their supporters. Apparently the Crusaders were cheered off the field last Saturday whereas the Stormers elicited a chorus of boos from their own fans.
There's already talk of the 'rest' continuing into the Bok games against Uruguay et al, again not a happy sign for the RSA rugby public.

[ravagon]

Originally posted by Havak
An interesting development on that Wales versus All Blacks game – it’s outside the official international weekends so English and French clubs are almost certain not to release players – and the WRU is worried that even it’s own franchises might not. It means they will probably face the All Blacks without Davies (hooker), Charvis (flanker), Jones (Fly half) and Thomas (Full back). I’m looking forward to the game more and more!!

Originally posted by Tamerlin

Finbar, I hope that your wife's daughter has found a husband, you can't count on me anymore on this ground.

I'm tempted to post the suggestion that he's gotten back with his ex but I fear that may bring about a deluge of of such epic proportions as to make the great -inspired rugby thread crash of 2002 seem mild by comparison ...


Completely off-topic (hence entirely appropriate to this thread), it's a great pity that there was no MP in the original Galciv.
I think I'm now almost at the level to challenge the mighty LDiCesare.

We'd still need a few house rules of course ...
He wouldn't be able to cononise anything with a PQ>14, build starbases or freighters, or trade or sell tech, but otherwise I think it'd be a rather even matchup. Heh heh.

[finbar]

Originally posted by ravagon
Morning all,

Got back from an 'unexpected' vacation yesterday and sat down to work out what'd happened while I was away ..

(a) The Blues are doing a lot better.

Relatively speaking. They're winning comfortably on the scoreboard but the margins have been blowing out late in the game with some soft tries. With the talent in their team, they're making hard work of earlier in the game. Carlos remains on the bench. His replacement is handy at best.

I take it that that Henjak chap is now in for Greegan?

Yes.

Apparently the Brumbies reserves were being targetted by the new Perth franchise as well as the hapless Reds, no idea if Henjak were included here or not (there was talk of the Brumbies reserves being 'decimated' - I know how finbar loves the word. ), but actually getting the chance to play the full 80m for a few games for a change may give him the incentive to stay?

Henjak will get to play the next four to six weeks but the longer term is the question. If Gregan plays on till the World Cup, which, I suspect, is likely, Henjak will warm the bench for another two years. I suspect he probably has to go to Perth for his own good. Or even elsewhere within Australia, which isn't out of the question. OTOH, if George decided not to play on, that's a different matter.

It looks as though Jake White is beginning to throw some weight around - RSA S12 sides are now coming under a bit of pressure to rest some of their Bok players in time for the upcoming 3N and International season. Only the Cats so far (and it may not have made a great deal of difference in the S12 standings or for their upcoming clash with the Crusaders I admit) but the other clubs may not be far behind.

Most of them are playing crap rugby anyway.

[Havak]

Four to six weeks. But it's the last thing the Brumbies needed.

Good news for the Wallabies though - he should be match fit in plenty of time.

Simple point really - he can kick straight.

Ah I see. Well at least this won’t be tested much – UK sides are notorious for how few penalties they give away in the SH with SH officials at the helm after all.

I was looking forward to it. And you didn't disappoint!

It made me feel better.

Cozza has his hearing this evening – at least a three week ban coming up.

Jonno, having reached three yellows for the season has also been summoned and will be banned for one game – but will miss the Wasps game rather than the Toulouse clash (sorry Tamerlin!).

With Cozza banned, Deacon suffering with an eye injury and Kay with a dodgy ankle I have no idea what locks we would play against Wasps in that very important game. Probably Hamilton and Ryder from the Development side – hardly ideal for facing Daylgo’s mob. Mind you we also have a 20 year old Aussie lock on our books – Daniel Montagu. But then he is from Perth so he is practically English anyway right?

To top it all off an English colleague dubbed me an 'honorary Englishman', from which I can only infer that Havak has been sticking those signs on my back again!

You didn’t see me then?

Welcome back! Your colleague actually means that as a compliment – it’s one of the greatest we can give in fact. They must like you.

You may as well have hinted at Tamerlin’s situation – if Toulouse lose on Sunday I suspect smilies may be in considerable evidence come Monday.

Most of them are playing crap rugby anyway.

This the side that won last years tri-nations and beat Wales just last November. After a promising start White is starting to resemble Robinson for the astounding level of IQ he suggests through his actions?

(He'll have the Boks having cold showers in trenches soon?)

[finbar]

Originally posted by Havak
Ah I see. Well at least this won’t be tested much – UK sides are notorious for how few penalties they give away in the SH with SH officials at the helm after all.

Carter will have RSI of the left leg after potting so many penalties!

Cozza has his hearing this evening – at least a three week ban coming up.

Jonno, having reached three yellows for the season has also been summoned and will be banned for one game –

Discipline!

Mind you we also have a 20 year old Aussie lock on our books – Daniel Montagu. But then he is from Perth so he is practically English anyway right?

No, just a bumpkin.

EDIT. Oh, and speaking of Perth, as I do as little as possible, the new franchise has announced its name - Western Force. Fools. How many losses will it take before the "o" is amended to an "a" in reference to them?

[Havak]

Only in England do we ban our very best player just as he is about to retire. I wouldn't mind but he didn't even punch the Sarries t***** - it was more of a 'heavy push'.

Western Force? Are you being serious?

I'm going to need some time to digest that before I can take it even vaguely seriously.

[finbar]

Some marketing wally's idea, no doubt.