If Darwin was correct

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Xin Yu
I proved one Nobel economic prize winner wrong by myself . My paper was not published but it was part of my PhD dissertation. Result: I got my PhD degree.

You proved this person wrong but it appears that you did not prove his work that got him the Nobel Prize wrong.

You know what? This is why science is good - although I don't consider economics a science. Science can be wrong: it fact, one fundamental aspect of a scientific theory is it can be falsified.

[beingofone]

Dauphin

One of its functions is to make the miraculous seem ordinary, and turn the unusual into the usual. Otherwise, human beings, forced with the daily wondrousness of everything, would go around wearing a stupid grin, saying "WOW" a lot. Part of the brain exists to stop this happening. It is very efficient, and can make people experience boredom in the middle of marvels

I believe this - though we might be the only two that do.
It gives us time to ponder ice cream.
"WOW" good post dude

A few quick questions.
1- If there are billions of cells that make up our body, and they all are performing some vital function like see, smell etc.
Which cell is the leader cell that organized all this?
Did he read the DNA blueprint somewhere so all the cells know their job?


2- If we do not understand how brain activity works (Adrian Hon`s post and others) we only know it is working.
And if this function is a requirement for awareness.
How can one make the gigantic leap to say
" I understand where life originated and and have a grasp on the nature of life`s existence"?

3- Intiger - can mean any number, the number zero or a secondary meaning is
" a complete entity".
Are you a complete entity? And if so how do you know you are a complete entity unless you compare yourself to someone or something?
And if you compare yourself, you by the nature of a comparison are incomplete - hmm ?

Maybe the answer is so simple - it is hard.
Children may understand more then we know.

[Provost Harrison]

Originally posted by beingofone
A few quick questions.
1- If there are billions of cells that make up our body, and they all are performing some vital function like see, smell etc.
Which cell is the leader cell that organized all this?
Did he read the DNA blueprint somewhere so all the cells know their job?

Basically a fractal pattern, as cells divide, hormones are released, cells differentiate. DNA is not a 'blueprint' as you know it, but it does act effectively as a 'timetable' for each cell with genes being switched on and off as appropriate depending on how it is hormonally controlled, stage of cell cycle and even how many cycles have occurred. That pattern dictates how it gets to this point. There is a lot to be learned about developmental biology, especially the molecular biology aspects of it. But we are getting there - it is just extraordinarily complex, that is all.

2- If we do not understand how brain activity works (Adrian Hon`s post and others) we only know it is working.
And if this function is a requirement for awareness.
How can one make the gigantic leap to say
" I understand where life originated and and have a grasp on the nature of life`s existence"?

We have the tools to find it out is the most confident quote we can make. The Bible gives no answers apart from those which have been concocted. The brain is extremely complex again, and it will take time to understand...

3- Intiger - can mean any number, the number zero or a secondary meaning is
" a complete entity".
Are you a complete entity? And if so how do you know you are a complete entity unless you compare yourself to someone or something?
And if you compare yourself, you by the nature of a comparison are incomplete - hmm ?

Maybe the answer is so simple - it is hard.
Children may understand more then we know.

Cogito ergo sum.

[beingofone]

Originally posted by Provost Harrison


Basically a fractal pattern, as cells divide, hormones are released, cells differentiate. DNA is not a 'blueprint' as you know it, but it does act effectively as a 'timetable' for each cell with genes being switched on and off as appropriate depending on how it is hormonally controlled, stage of cell cycle and even how many cycles have occurred. That pattern dictates how it gets to this point. There is a lot to be learned about developmental biology, especially the molecular biology aspects of it. But we are getting there - it is just extraordinarily complex, that is all.

Interesting - fractal pattern , is not the entire universe basically a fractal pattern?
Here is a thought.
Perhaps I am a fractal pattern of something beyond my comprehension at this point in my development.
Like a single cell in all likelyhood is unaware of the greater whole.
Think in terms of atomic structure and upwards.
Perhaps evolution is correct and I am evolving into something I cannot as of yet comprehend.

Please don`t spindle this next statement into something it is not mean`t to be.
Perhaps when God looks at you he sees himself.
One day you may be able to look at God and see our own reflection.

We have the tools to find it out is the most confident quote we can make. The Bible gives no answers apart from those which have been concocted. The brain is extremely complex again, and it will take time to understand...



Cogito ergo sum.

Are you aware of anything other than your own subjective consciousness?
If not - therein exists a singularity in the universe.

The scripture does give some explanation as do other spiritual writings.
Jesus believed that the universe did not breathe life into his consciousness. He believed that the universe existed as a result of his awareness as did Lao Tzu, Gautama and others.
If I am not mistaken Einstein began to lean tword this conclusion in his later years.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by beingofone
2- If we do not understand how brain activity works (Adrian Hon`s post and others) we only know it is working.
And if this function is a requirement for awareness.
How can one make the gigantic leap to say
" I understand where life originated and and have a grasp on the nature of life`s existence"?

You don't need to know how something works before you use it. Do you know how your car works? What about your computer? The Internet? Your television? Nevertheless, such lack of knowledge do not prevent you from using them.

Do you know how your body digest food? Do you know how your body breaks down food to produce energy? Yet you eat and breathe nevertheless.

Originally posted by beingofone
3- Intiger - can mean any number, the number zero or a secondary meaning is "a complete entity".

1. An integer does not mean any number.
2. Define "complete entity."

[Xin Yu]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger
You proved this person wrong but it appears that you did not prove his work that got him the Nobel Prize wrong.

I think I did since his price winning model was based on the same set of assumptions, just that after several years of continued research he made it more complicated. He got the Nobel price for his work on the model which consisted several years of work, including the paper I found to be wrong.

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by Xin Yu
Well, it has a name of '**** model' and was using linear regression. My major was statistics so that's why my PhD dissertation could discuss it.

That's all math, not science. Two different things.

Economics is not scientific, although it is (sometimes, I suppose) mathematical. You'll never have any scientific theories of economics, because economics is a man-made concept, just like numbers.

[Xin Yu]

I saw repeated argument of: 'you don't know sh*t about the evolution theory so don't criticize it.'

Is that a valid argument? I mean, can we apply it to other topics: Have you studied the theory of communism? Do you fully understand how slavery works? You don't? Then until you do, communism is the correct system and slavery is superior than paying salaries to workers.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by beingofone
Are you aware of anything other than your own subjective consciousness?

Yes. My body, for starters.

Originally posted by beingofone
Jesus believed that the universe did not breathe life into his consciousness. He believed that the universe existed as a result of his awareness as did Lao Tzu, Gautama and others.

I know Lao Tzu did not say anything like that. Gautama did not say that either. Where in the bible does it mention that Jesus said something like that?

Originally posted by beingofone
If I am not mistaken Einstein began to lean tword this conclusion in his later years.

You are mistaken.

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by Xin Yu
I saw repeated argument of: 'you don't know sh*t about the evolution theory so don't criticize it.'

Is that a valid argument? I mean, can we apply it to other topics: Have you studied the theory of communism? Do you fully understand how slavery works? You don't? Then until you do, communism is the correct system and slavery is superior than paying salaries to workers.

And this is a terrible analogy, as you can't equate a scientific theory and a political philosophy such as communism. Science and philosophy are very, very different things. Science is based on objective observations and experimentations on the natural world. Objections to communism comes from a subjective moral stance on a man-made political creed. Moral stances are irrelevant to the veracity of scientific facts.

If you can't see why throwing out criticisms of a scientific theory without knowing anything about what the theory says or how it works is the worst kind of ignorance, then I'm afraid no one here can help you.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Xin Yu
I saw repeated argument of: 'you don't know sh*t about the evolution theory so don't criticize it.'

Is that a valid argument?

Absolutely. How do you criticise a scientific theory you know nothing about? More precisely, it is implausible for you to make valid objections.

Originally posted by Xin Yu
I mean, can we apply it to other topics: Have you studied the theory of communism?

Yes.

Originally posted by Xin Yu
Do you fully understand how slavery works? You don't? Then until you do, communism is the correct system and slavery is superior than paying salaries to workers.

Your analogy doesn't wash. You can criticise slavary on ethical grounds alone.

[Xin Yu]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov
That's all math, not science. Two different things.

But I think there is 'natual science' and 'social science'? And social science includes economics (and evolution theory)?

[Boris Godunov]

No... evolution is definitely a natural science.

"Social sciences" are not sciences in the sense that they are products of scientific method. The word "science" doesn't mean the same thing there.

[Xin Yu]

Urban ranger,

OK, you know communism. How about Christianity, Islam, Buddaism, Taoism, Confucious, Voodoo?

Until you don't fully understand voodoo, it is the truth of life. How about that?

[Mercator]

Originally posted by Xin Yu
I saw repeated argument of: 'you don't know sh*t about the evolution theory so don't criticize it.'

Is that a valid argument? I mean, can we apply it to other topics: Have you studied the theory of communism? Do you fully understand how slavery works? You don't? Then until you do, communism is the correct system and slavery is superior than paying salaries to workers.

No, that's not what we're saying. We're saying that if you don't know evolution theory you can't say it isn't the correct system.


There's a green book lying on my desk. Since you haven't seen the book, you can't say whether I'm right or wrong. Of course, you could guess the correct answer. But that isn't how science works, is it? Science is based on evidence. Without seeing the book you can never be 100% sure that it's green or not.

But, if I were to claim the book is completely green, you wouldn't necessarily have to see the entire book to dismiss that claim. If you could see only a tiny portion of it, and that part happened to be white, you'd have proven me wrong already. But if the part you saw was green, we'd have the same situation as earlier.