Arafat Had Done it Again. Abu Mazen Quits.

[Sirotnikov]

GS - Israel did pull out from the towns, and now sits around them.

If he would try to have elections and Israel would prevent him from doing so, it would have been a great card to use to make Israel retreat from the PA areas.

But he didn't try to have elections and then blamed it on Israel. He preferred to let the whole idea be forgotten.

Btw, his demands of Abu Mazen were that at least 17 of Arafat's previuos ministers remain in the cabinet. Then he lowered the demand to 14. His main clashes with Abu Mazen were on th roles Abu Mazen gets compared to himself, and thr fact that Abu Mazen intended to introduce several key people who were Arafat's opposition and wouldn't listen to his directions.

Infact Abu Mazen wanted a strong independant regime.

Even though Abu Mazen's people were not as popular as Arafat himself, Arafat's current government is hated by the people for it's corruption. Arafat has been reshuffling portfolios among pretty much the same people, ever since he took power.

[gsmoove23]

Siro - The IDF never pulled completely out of PA administered areas and still enters towns whenever it wants. I hardly think Arafat would have had honest elections, which is why he demanded the IDF withdraw when he knew it wouldn't.

I doubt Arafat is very popular in Palestine right now but the most popular alternative would probably be Hamas.

[Edan]

I hardly think Arafat would have had honest elections

How true, how true - I mean, why start now?

[Canuck]

Originally posted by GePap


it takes two to create a trend...its the next guy who will. Honestly, if a guy is giving up the Holy land to a bunch of Jew killers, wouldn't you kill him?

It is only a matter of time.

A vast majority of the Israeli population supports the establishment of a Palestinian state. The most ultra orthodox of Jews don't support the establishment of a Jewish state so Israeli extremists are the exception, not the rule imo.

[Canuck]

Originally posted by Sirotnikov
GS - Israel did pull out from the towns, and now sits around them.

If he would try to have elections and Israel would prevent him from doing so, it would have been a great card to use to make Israel retreat from the PA areas.

But he didn't try to have elections and then blamed it on Israel. He preferred to let the whole idea be forgotten.

Btw, his demands of Abu Mazen were that at least 17 of Arafat's previuos ministers remain in the cabinet. Then he lowered the demand to 14. His main clashes with Abu Mazen were on th roles Abu Mazen gets compared to himself, and thr fact that Abu Mazen intended to introduce several key people who were Arafat's opposition and wouldn't listen to his directions.

Infact Abu Mazen wanted a strong independant regime.

Even though Abu Mazen's people were not as popular as Arafat himself, Arafat's current government is hated by the people for it's corruption. Arafat has been reshuffling portfolios among pretty much the same people, ever since he took power.

Yup, it seems the biggest obstacle to agreement between Mazzen and Arafat was the appointment of Dahlan, a man who has disregarded Arafat's instructions in the past. Imo Arafat has used the PA's security forces to encourage Palestinian militants rather than to undermine them, as he promised the Israelis. Arafat still wants complete control of the PA's security forces so that the violence can continue.

[GePap]

That does not matter: it is not majorities who commit violence, it is the extremists who start and then force people to chose sides. I have no doubt that once the Israeli government is forced (because it will be forced) to remove settlement blocks from gaza and specially form the West Bank (Hebron specially) right-wing extremist and their allies will commit acts of violence. Israeli society looks to have many internal fractures that have been forced down by the feeling of an external threat, but once push comes to shove and actions deeply against one group or another come, things will explode. I don;t mean any type of general civil war, but acts of violence are likely.

[Zevico]

Gnu:
Did you read the JPost article in question? I believe it said he -threatened- to resign. Not that he actually resigned.
In addition:
When was the last time they covered a massacre up? They certainly had information about that so called 'massacre' of yours, and I can almost assure you they had it before anyone else, too.

Also, Gnu, as the articles above tend to show, your 'massacre' is an incorrect term. Massacre would be when they went in trying to kill people wherever they went, regardless of who they are.

Imran, when was JPost shown to have an agenda, or be biased against Palestinians?

[Sirotnikov]

Siro - The IDF never pulled completely out of PA administered areas and still enters towns whenever it wants. I hardly think Arafat would have had honest elections, which is why he demanded the IDF withdraw when he knew it wouldn't.

But if he suppesdly declared 1st of April elections day, Israel would be very weary not to enter the PA towns in the sorrounding days, so that not to get blamed, at least.

I doubt Arafat is very popular in Palestine right now but the most popular alternative would probably be Hamas.

True.
2 reasons.
1. Many want revenge (obvious)
2. Arafat is a stealing corrupt leader and his people know it. Arafat is taking most of the money donated to the Pals, distributes it among himself, his aides and some to weapons and fighters. Hamas on the other hand, is infact also a very large charity. That makes it ever more popular, which is scary. But they are doing holy work, in a sense, since a large part of their cash does go to improve poor people's lives.

[Sirotnikov]

They finally agreed on a government which will include Mohammed Dahlan.

According to CNN, Egyptian sources said that this followed US pressure and a US commitment for Arafat's personal safety (ie it won't allow Israel to kick Arafat out).

I remind you, Arafat still has a veto and still has most of the important issues in his hands.

[CyberGnu]

Panag:

hi ,

try the website of the PA , ....


bye

The PA website claims Abu Mazen quit?

[CyberGnu]

funny how no-one uses the word " massacare " when 6 Israeli civilians are murdered at home , ....

You mean no one apart from the ~10 rabid pro-israelis on this board? The same ones who think 15 civilians killed in a rocket attack totally OK, cause they shouldn't have lived in the same house as the wife of a man accused of terrorism?

Ahh, yes...

But apart from that, I'll call it a massacre after Israel has ended the occupation.

[CyberGnu]

Edan:

Ahh, so when CNN covering up Saddams crimes in order to maintain close news connections with the country rather than pull out of the country and tell their viewers the truth why they pulled out - thats journalistic integritiy.

Cover up Saddams crimes? I think I missed that part in the story. Where did it say that CNN lied to help Saddam? Oh, wait, are you confusing "covering up" with "acting in accordance to ethical guidelines"?

From NPR's ethical guidelines:
Journalists at all times will show respect for the dignity, privacy, rights, and well-being of people encountered in the course of gathering and presenting the news.

[CyberGnu]

But an Israeli newspaper that has an article about Abu Mazen that doesn't also mention the Palestinian deaths (which apparently took place sometime after the Abu Mazen incident since all the stories I can find about it were written after the Abu Mazen story broke) thats a vast Israeli conspiracy... Well, I'm sorry you don't like that some news articles only cover one issue, and that some news paper articles don't report news from the future.

Are you taking a lesson from Drake here? Why don't you go back in the thread and read it? Eight post in the third page, in particular.

[CyberGnu]

Thats because they were written aboout 6-18 hours after the first article, and after Mazen agreed to meet with Arafat. Duh.

And that's what happens when a paper prints stuff without checking facts first. Duh.

[CyberGnu]

Ned:

All I can say is that Arafat remains the boss and the problem. I remain very pessimistic for the chances of peace so long as the Palestinians are lead by this man.

Sadly, yes. As long as Arafat is in power, Sharon can use him as an excuse for not moving towards a peaceful solution...

I can only hope that a requirement for any new Palestinian State is that it be democratic, i.e., have regular elections and a real multiparty sytem. I don't think democracy can work so long a Arafat, and perhap his cronies, are in power.

I don't think that democracy can work as long as Sharon, or his cronies, are in power... Sure, Arafat would do everything in his power to stay as leader of palestine, but without Israels occupation he would have a revolution on his hands if he tried to stop elections. As the events of this last week has shown us.