The Battle of Baghdad

[Kramerman]

Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat
Both.

I knew you'd say that.
actually, i thought you were gonna say, "a little from column A, aaaand a little from column B..."

[Ned]

It looks like the ships carrying the 4th infantry division will not arrive in Kuwait until next week. Meanwhile the commander of the 24th infantry infantry division that was so successful during the first Gulf War is highly critical of starting the current campaign without the presence of the 4th infantry division. He says that the 4th infantry division is necessary to take Baghdad, and that a [two week] delay until they arrive at Baghdad will give the Iraqi's time to regroup. He also critical of the fact that the 1st cavalry has not been deployed because cavalry is necessary to protect the flanks and supply lines of the heavy infantry divisions as they advance.

Also, given the information that the 7th Cav is to the East of an Najaf, it appears more likely that the pincer on the Medina division will comprise a frontal assaulty by the 3rd ID from Karbala, the 7th Cav from the East, and the 101st from the Northwest.

http://www.msnbc.com/news/890300.asp?0sl=-32

[MichaeltheGreat]

Originally posted by DanS
Airpower will prevent any retreat with heavy weapons into Baghdad or manuever to support each other with counter-attacks.

Is the airpower sufficient to do this?

Once you get into the river country between Karbala, al Hillah, and Baghdad, it's soft ground and marshy in a lot of areas - too soft to not bog down a lot of armored vehicles - that means killing vehicles at the heads of their columns will really restrict movement. Worst case, or best case depending on how you look at it, we could drop some of those bridges along their line of retreat and make sure nobody got out.

In that case, we'd have to use some of our bridging engineer assets to replace bridges, but IMO it's better than letting them get out.

[Drake Tungsten]

I'm really starting to get the feeling that the US military has a huge disinformation campaign underway and that we don't have a clue what the troop movements are really like. It almost seems like we're making a big deal out of Iraqi resistance in order to convince the Iraqis that they can beat us so that they will stay out of Baghdad and be destroyed. I hope it works...

[TheStinger]

The British 16 th air assault brigade haven't done much yet, I suppose they can be heloed up if needed. The other UK units will be used in taking Bassra I suppose

[Sir Og]

The Iraqi command should have a clue as to what the US is trying to achieve (surrounding the Medina division) it’s been mentioned on CNN even. They are probably going to try to withdraw it to Baghdad or to outmaneuver the US forces in some way so that don’t get surrounded.

[Ned]

Our strategy in Iraq reminds me of two prior campaigns in military history: The first is when Scipio Africanus took command in Spain. Instead of getting bogged down on inconclusive campaign against the Carthaginian army, Scipio instead marched deep into the Carthaginian rear and took their supply base. After that, Carthaginian resistance in Spain collapsed.

The other campaign our strategy brings to mind is the German campaign in Russia in 1941. I believe the Germans had three Army groups, one to take Leningrad, one to take Moscow and a third to take Kiev. However, each of the Army groups had insufficient power to take their objectives before winter. Hitler concentrated his forces to take Kiev instead of Moscow. The rest is history. Hitler never took Moscow and may have lost the war because of that.

I suspect the military historians look at Scipio's campaign as an example of how to kill a snake by lopping off its head and the German campaign as an example of forgetting the larger, more important objective in order to take low-hanging fruit.

[DanS]

Looks like the 4th Infantry Division might be available earlier than we thought.

http://asia.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=topNews&storyID=2453114

Yesterday, I heard a report from a guy in Baghdad that rumors in the city is that we were approaching from the West. This would fit MtG's take on the battle, so far.

[Drake Tungsten]

Where the hell is the 1st Armored Division? The only info I could find on them said that they weren't shipping out to the Gulf at all because of "transport difficulties." Is that true or just disinformation? If the 4th Infantry is the only follow-on force we have, then this could end up being a disaster...

I hope the media is just out of the loop, not that our military is incompetent.

[DanS]

Amazing battle coming up, apparently. 1,000 vehicle column coming from Baghdad. Could meet the US forces this evening. Don't know the weather and if the Longbows will be able to join the battle, so this one should be interesting.

[Ned]

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten
Where the hell is the 1st Armored Division? The only info I could find on them said that they weren't shipping out to the Gulf at all because of "transport difficulties." Is that true or just disinformation? If the 4th Infantry is the only follow-on force we have, then this could end up being a disaster...

I hope the media is just out of the loop, not that our military is incompetent.

There is a story running on CNN right know about a Germany-based airborne regiment that just took an airfield in Northern Iraq. I caught only a portion of the story, but I thought I heard that we were going to move the 1st Armored Division in from Germany ASAP.

[Ned]

Originally posted by DanS
Amazing battle coming up, apparently. 1,000 vehicle column coming from Baghdad. Could meet the US forces this evening. Don't know the weather and if the Longbows will be able to join the battle, so this one should be interesting.

It looks like they are heading for the 7th Cav. The weather is still bad. They may not be able to use choppers or laser-guided weapons. The 7th Cav has been reinforced. But they still may be significantly outnumbered.

[Drake Tungsten]

I caught only a portion of the story, but I thought I heard that we were going to move the 1st Armored Division in from Germany ASAP.

How? If the 1st Armored is still in Germany, it would take weeks to get to the theater. You can't airlift M-1's to the best of my knowledge.

[Ned]

Correction, they are airlifting, at least initially, a brigade of the 1st Infantry. It is mechanized.

A general on CNN said the C17 can carry M1's.

[Drake Tungsten]

A general on CNN said the C17 can carry M1's.

Well, if the C17 can carry M1's then the C5 can too. I guess my information was wrong...