Can we Create an America that can Lead the World

[DuncanK]

And better than I could have

[Alexander's Horse]

And all the little countries aren't so little.

[Drake Tungsten]

Are well you have just put your finger on everything that is wrong with current thinking in your country.

You may think it is "wrong", but it reflects reality. America has no equal on the world stage right now.

[Velociryx]

Drake, while what you say is true, it is also true that the most respected and able leaders lead by example, or not at all.

THAT is the crux and point of my first post, and my post in the "post cold war landscape" thread.

The US is uniquely positioned *right now* to truly make a difference, world wide....if only we try to live up to the ideals we were founded on, and if only we are willing to put our own interests aside for the interests of humanity (and by the way, it should be noted that in serving the interests of humanity, we wind up serving some of our own interests as well....but in a very differente way than we're doing now).

-=Vel=-

[Alexander's Horse]

That's what you think Drake - lol.

And even if you think it, you shouldn't say it publicly.

Its this kind of arrogance and hubris which has got you into the fine pickle you are in today.

Feeling omnipotent at the moment? (tee hee)

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Sava
At this point, I think that only a revolution can effectively do away with this economic slavery.

Welcome to the party, comrade!


BTW, stay away from the ISO. They're rather cult-like and pretty lousy Marxists. But they're kinda strong at DePaul University.

I strongly suggest heading west on Fullerton and going to New World Resource Center, at Rockwell and Fullerton. It's an all-point's-of-view-on-the-left bookstore. They could probably use you as a volunteer. Get in touch with Dr. Pelz and talk w/ him. He used to teach at DePaul, now teaches at Elgin Community College. He's a very smart many and is friggan' hilarious.

[Drake Tungsten]

Drake, while what you say is true, it is also true that the most respected and able leaders lead by example, or not at all.

I don't disagree with you, Velo. I was just pointing out the problems in AH's "first among equals" policy. It doesn't work very well in a world where the US has no equals and its closest allies aren't even making an effort to sit at the big kid's table.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Velociryx
At its core, and on the moment of its birth, the beast was created to serve the people....

No, it wasn't. It was created to serve the interests of the merchants, landlords, and slaveholders of colonial America. Although the franchise has expanded, the same class of people which ruled then, rule today. It's their beast, not ours. It knows its master, and any attempt to try and take it for ourselves will only rsult in disaster. As Marx put it in his preface to the 1872 edition of the Communist Manifesto, "One thing especially was proved by the Commune, viz., that 'the working class cannot simply lay hold of ready-made state machinery, and wield it for its own purposes.'"

[Alexander's Horse]

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten

I don't disagree with you, Velo. I was just pointing out the problems in AH's "first among equals" policy. It doesn't work very well in a world where the US has no equals and its closest allies aren't even making an effort to sit at the big kid's table.

But your view of other countries is completely wrong.

I see a big fall for somebody ahead unless this attitude changes. I really do - and in fact it already seems to be starting, LOL.

But at the end of the day, you can warn but people have to make their own mistakes, especially when they hell bent on a view of the world and their place in it.

[Velociryx]

Che....that's splitting hairs. IF what you are saying were true, IF the only interests to be served were among the groups you named off, then there would not have been....I repeat *would not have been* any increase in the franchise at all. None whatsoever.

And why not?

Because there would be no incentive for those groups to share power.

That we have seen the francise increase, and increase steadily over the years our country has been around invalidates your argument completely, IMO.

I know you'd rather turn me to the "dark side" as it were, and join the Communist fight, but it ain't gonna happen.

I have seen a sufficient number of communist implosions to realize that particular horse has been beaten to death.

-=Vel=-

[Velociryx]

AH - I like your style....when I'm elected President of the US, I'd like you to consider a cabinet level position...special advisor at the very least....

-=Vel=-

[Drake Tungsten]

But your view of other countries is completely wrong.

Prove it. Show me one other country that is anywhere close to being America's equal.

I don't know why you're accusing me of arrogance. I haven't made any recommendations on what the US should do or not do with its unrivaled power; I merely noted that it exists. It isn't arrogant to state the way things are.

[Velociryx]

Drake - I think the point he's trying to make is that "wise is the king who wields his power lightly."

Indeed, what you say is correct, and because it is correct, because America is the big dog on the block, it is not something that needs be spoken of.

The grizzley bear in the forest KNOWS he's the biggest game in town, as do all the smaller (and not so smaller) creatures around him.

-=Vel=-

[DuncanK]

Originally posted by Velociryx

I have seen a sufficient number of communist implosions to realize that particular horse has been beaten to death.

-=Vel=-

Capitalism has a much higher failure rate.

[Drake Tungsten]

Drake - I think the point he's trying to make is that "wise is the king who wields his power lightly."

If that's what he's saying, then I agree with him completely. I never said that America should go around doing whatever it wants just because it can.