Re-Shaping the landscape in the wake of the Cold War

[Willem]

Originally posted by DuncanK
i don't think that was Mao, but it is good.

But utterly impossible.

[Odin]

Technically, though not legally, rich people are "american nobility" since they get favors from, and have the access to, the government that the common person doesn't. The US has a nobility, but they are called executives instead of counts or earls.

Ned: Yep, the rich b@stards must die!

[Willem]

Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe

The Dem theory that monies in the hands of the poor will find its way into circulation and cause demand for goods and services is IMO not valid as the demand will be mostly for lowest denominator goods and services. These are not likely IMO to create jobs in a complex supply chain.

Consumer spending accounts for 60% of the overall economy, the last figure I came across. So anything you do that will stimulate that will be a good thing.

[DuncanK]

Originally posted by Arrian
Duncan,

We do not, in fact, have equal opportunity yet. It's a work in progress. I do not expect we will EVER have 100% equal opportunities in life - we're not perfect, and no system we come up with will be either.

I do want us to keep working at equality of opportunity, though. I do NOT want us to aim at equality of outcomes.

-Arrian

When we have something close to equality of outcomes we will also be close to equality of opportunity. All theoretical with capitalism of course.

The fact that we are so far away from equality of outcomes shows how far we are away from equality of opportunity.

[DuncanK]

Originally posted by Ned


Then, let's work on this issue.

What kills equal opportunity: bad schools, bad parents, divorce, racism, sexism, and, most of all, the lack of jobs.

It's more complicated than that. You and I will never have the opportunities that Bill Gates has until we have the resources, information, and connections that he has. And that will never happen.

[Az]

actually, Bill Gates is an opposite example, of getting rich and famous, against the odds.

[DuncanK]

Originally posted by Willem


But utterly impossible.

You are a business leader. I don't want to tell you how to be one, but I think you should take that quote more seriously.

[DuncanK]

Originally posted by Azazel
actually, Bill Gates is an opposite example, of getting rich and famous, against the odds.

Yeah, he was working class, but he was very ruthless on his way to the top. So I like this example.

[Velociryx]

ARGH! No, No, No!

IF you want equality of outcomes, then you DOOM the society you are trying to build!

You doom it because I can do NOTHING....zip, zero, zilch, nada, and get the SAME outcome as a person who works hard for twenty hours a day.

THAT is a far more insidious form of "exploitation" than anything you will ever see in a capitalist society, and it *exactly* what your plan will bring about!

-=Vel=-

[Az]

doesn't prove your current point ( unequality of opportunity)

One of my major beefs with capitalism is that a richie rich kid can get all the help he needs, while a poor kid can be brilliant but grow up in an enviroment that would lead him to crime.

Not only it is a personal tragedy, but it's also a such a waste.

[Willem]

Originally posted by DuncanK


You are a business leader. I don't want to tell you how to be one, but I think you should take that quote more seriously.

Who said anything about being a business leader? I'm self-employed but I'm just another schmuck who's trying to pay his bills every month, and have a little left over for some fun.

And I do take that quote seriously. No amount of wishful thinking will make something function outside of it's inherent nature. It's not the egg's nature to become an omelette, therefor it will never be one unless we make it so.

[Velociryx]

And the more probable outcome would be:

Richie kid sqanders daddy's money and winds up spending his life in a rehab clinic where his family come and dote on him occassionally, and the poor, brilliant kid starts off playing speed chess for money or somesuch, and bootstraps his way to success.

I know lots of smart people who used to be poor. And I know lots of lazy people who used to be rich, and who are now struggling.

-=Vel=-

[Willem]

Originally posted by Azazel
doesn't prove your current point ( unequality of opportunity)

One of my major beefs with capitalism is that a richie rich kid can get all the help he needs, while a poor kid can be brilliant but grow up in an enviroment that would lead him to crime.

Not only it is a personal tragedy, but it's also a such a waste.

I'd say that's the failure of the school system, not capitalism.

[Harovan]

Originally posted by DuncanK
Yeah, he was working class, but he was very ruthless on his way to the top. So I like this example.

William III Gates started with $10 million from his rich dad. I would love to be this kind of "working class".

[Az]

didn't know that, Sir Ralph. thumbs up on the heads up.