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The Battle of Baghdad

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  • #76
    There were two articles on www.strategypage.com (most stuff is from gung-ho military guys - so be aware) last summer that were pretty interesting. I'll link them here and edit in a couple of snipets:



    ...the shaky nature of his fear-driven regime makes Iraqi WMD use, or threats of use, problematic after an American invasion starts.

    Saddam's security forces would then have major incentives to shoot him, to produce a better outcome for themselves. Fear of Saddam would decrease, fear of us grow, and the chances of Saddam's assassination increase, at exponential rates after the invasion starts. The Iraqis learned to think of us as supermen during Desert Storm, with the Taliban's recent demise reminding them. There is no reasonable expectation of Iraqi survival once a U.S. invasion begins, even if Iraq then uses WMD.

    Saddam's best chance of survival is therefore deterrence of invasion...





    The Saudi regime has major problems at home such that we might not be able to keep them in power much longer even if we wanted to (its domestic problems are what drives its funding of terrorism), and it certainly can't stay in power if the U.S. government attempts to bring it down through overt (blockade) or covert means.


    Interesting scenarios to consider, though clearly just that.
    Last edited by Sten Sture; January 31, 2003, 17:38.
    Be the bid!

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    • #77
      Originally posted by lord of the mark


      Note I said since 1991. Panama was in 1989 (iirc) grenad in 1984, and US withdrew from Viet nam in 1972.
      The shah was overthrown in 1979, Somoza in the mid-70's IIRC.

      The cold war was a different time, I was trying to refer to the post cold war era.

      You did read my post, didnt you?????
      Historians don't consider anything less then 20 years ago as history. That's because we can't determine true changes within that time.
      "When you ride alone, you ride with Bin Ladin"-Bill Maher
      "All capital is dripping with blood."-Karl Marx
      "Of course, my response to your Marx quote is 'So?'"-Imran Siddiqui

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      • #78
        The US is not to be compared with Romans. First, we have not even entered the imperial stage yet, and may never do. Second, Romans were not invincible, they had several crushing defeats(Cannae 217BC, Carrhae 53BC, and Teutoburger Forest 9AD) in their history even before the decline. All these defeats literally wiped out large fractions of their manpower. The US has yet to suffer any defeat of such magnitude.

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        • #79
          Rumors circulating here in NC, supposedly from Fort Bragg speak of new urban warfare tactics including a special device capable of disabling all persons in a radius of a typical city block long enough for specially equiped soilders to infiltrate and subdue with minimal risk and casualties.

          I would hope to hear MTG confirm or refute this rumor as I have no idea.

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          • #80
            The US got into some very intense battles in WWII, both theaters, and in Korean and Vietnam. We did very well in those most of those battles, all told. The reason we did well was firepower.

            But, if the enemy is determined and has plenty of ammo, it can put up quite a resistance. I am thinking of the Russians before Moscow in '41 and at Stalingrad late '42 and the Germans in the winter '42-43 attack on Army Group Center and at Berlin in '45. Those were bloodbaths.
            http://tools.wikimedia.de/~gmaxwell/jorbis/JOrbisPlayer.php?path=John+Williams+The+Imperial+M arch+from+The+Empire+Strikes+Back.ogg&wiki=en

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            • #81
              We are very close now...the question is, will the Iraqis in Baghdad put up a fight?
              Long time member @ Apolyton
              Civilization player since the dawn of time

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              • #82
                I heard on FOX that elements of the Republican Guard have expressed the desire to surrender. If so, the battle of Baghdad will be easier. The Republican guard are the ones deployed to defend the city.
                Long time member @ Apolyton
                Civilization player since the dawn of time

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                • #83
                  Originally posted by Lancer
                  I heard on FOX
                  Not that I doubt the journalistic integrity of FOX, but are there any other sources?
                  One day Canada will rule the world, and then we'll all be sorry.

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                  • #84
                    Originally posted by SlowwHand
                    I last longer in bed than the Iraqii army will last in battle.
                    The Iraqi's will start fighting...
                    To us, it is the BEAST.

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                    • #85
                      BC, not yet. My hopes are up though.
                      Long time member @ Apolyton
                      Civilization player since the dawn of time

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                      • #86
                        Pentagon quotes...

                        "So far, so very good"

                        If you have to ask, "is that 'shock and awe', then it's not. You'll know it when you see it."
                        Long time member @ Apolyton
                        Civilization player since the dawn of time

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                        • #87
                          So far, I'm shocked and awed by MSNBC's Brian Williams, and the amount of times he says "uh".
                          To us, it is the BEAST.

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                          • #88
                            uh, well...they aren't "fair and balanced" either.

                            I'd love to be rolling through Iraq, heading towards Baghdad, stopping to let the Iraqi army kiss my hand...except for the chem weapons thing...
                            Long time member @ Apolyton
                            Civilization player since the dawn of time

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                            • #89
                              I'm switching around stations... I just have the TV on in case there are more cool explosions. Right now I'm listening to "The Score" sports radio 670 AM. There's a funny segment called "who you crapping" on right now. Thursdays at 1:30-2:00 PM on Thursdays is the best radio.
                              To us, it is the BEAST.

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                              • #90
                                Originally posted by Spiffor
                                Sloww : didn't you predict W. would go to Iran right next ?
                                hopefully we will, diplomatically at first, adn if they fail to comply, then militarily if we have to. IIRC, they have a functioning plutonium manufcaturing reactor, and another Uranium enrichment plant that we just found out about not long ago. With Iran's chief enemy, Saddam Hussein's regime, is no more, hopefully they will have no more reason to persue weapons of mass destruction adn will comply.
                                "I bet Ikarus eats his own spunk..."
                                - BLACKENED from America's Army: Operations
                                Kramerman - Creator and Author of The Epic Tale of Navalon in the Civ III Stories Forum

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