Old Europe left out in the cold?

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by paiktis22
BTW dont let your nationality or opinions get the best of you. Germany and France are the cornerstone of the EU's integration process. No letters change that.

cant wait to see what Paki says when France supports us.

[lord of the mark]

quote:
"The letter is a move, which poses a problem, because it was done without necessary consultation. But it is also an expression of opinion, which is free among the member states, Simitis said"

"The way that was followed (by the letter) shows there was a lack of consultation, there was no information. This way, we are not helping Europe have a strong voice in the world,"


exactly the same could be said about the French-german statements.

[Spiffor]

I think you'll have to wait for the day the UN votes, when France suprisingly will vote yes. No doubt we'll all have forgotten this discussion by then.

[Bereta_Eder]

definitely.
but lessons can be taken from it by the way EU acts onm this issue.

[Harovan]

Originally posted by Oerdin
Also why is it Paris & Berlin seem to feel they have a good given right to dictate policy to everyone else? They seldom, if ever, have anyone's best interests in mind but their own so why follow dogmatically what they say?

They don't have this right. Do the United States have it? If not, why should anyone follow dogmatically what they say? If yes, why?

Also, neither France nor Germany dictate anything. They just say, no for us, you do what you want. What's wrong with it? The only power, who constantly tries all means of threat and pressure to force their policy to all others, is who? The "Land of the free, and the home of the brave".

[Bereta_Eder]

Also it is ridiculous in this respect: most of the 8 are completely "uknown' and they got a first hand opportunity to feel important. this is not to be udnerestimated either

[Az]

says the "chairman of the EU'R'us".

[Bereta_Eder]

what I said is definitely a minor but funny point

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Spiffor
I think you'll have to wait for the day the UN votes, when France suprisingly will vote yes. No doubt we'll all have forgotten this discussion by then.

I may not have forgotten, but i will nonetheless be ready with vive le france, some brie, and maybe even a Bordeaux if i can find a bottle thats a deal (well then make a rhone - er forget that make it a california wine with a french name)

[Bereta_Eder]

German Chancellor Gerhard Schroeder was dismissive of the statement. "There exists a European position (held) by 15, not by eight," he told ZDF television, referring to a declaration by EU foreign ministers Monday which urged Iraq to cooperate.

but hey let's do a letter anyway, it would make us look good to the US

please

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by paiktis22




but hey let's do a letter anyway, it would make us look good to the US

please

tell me again how urging iraq to cooperate contradicts anything in the letter.

[Bereta_Eder]

the letter was not only uneccaisery and a showbiz move but also hurt the EU's efforts for a comprehensive unified ONE opinion on thematter that IS the synthesis of the opposing views.


how difficult is this to grasp?

[Harovan]

Originally posted by Winston
Slovakia and Latvia are now backing the declaration by the European Eight.

Now Saddams fate is sealed.

[Bereta_Eder]

Well he should have seen it coming

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by paiktis22


the letter was not only uneccaisery and a showbiz move but also hurt the EU's efforts for a comprehensive unified ONE opinion on thematter that IS the synthesis of the opposing views.


how difficult is this to grasp?

but how can it hurt the efforts for synthesis on the opposing views if it disagrees with NOTHING that is in the stated EU position

(Hint - heres how - the french voted for res 1441 - which demands immediate Iraqi disarmament - the currrent german-french stance, which wants inspections to continue for containment contradicts 1441 - but because France voted for it, they cant come right out and say it - so the letter attacks what everyone knows is the REAL French-German position, but which is not their explicit public position, and which has certainly never been approved by the EU- the EU is trying to create a synthesis between the pro-1441 view of the 8, and the anti-1441 of the French and Germans, and it is that attempt tht the 8 undecut with their letter. )