Nintendo To Release New Console

[Asher]

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten
I'm sorry, you are right. Nintendo should've foresaw in the '80's that the franchises they were creating (Mario, Donkey Kong, Zelda) would be viewed as childish 20 years later. How shortsighted of them...

It's not necessarily the franchises themselves that are considered kiddie...

Once Nintendo gave them a waterpack and a name appended with "Sunshine" they start being viewed as kiddie.

Once they make Zelda look like a saturday mornning cartoon it's viewed as kiddie.

Once they release these games for a purple console with a handle that looks like a Fisher-Price toy, they are viewed as kiddie...

MS would pimp the hell out of Pokemon if they had it; it's a cash cow.

No kidding.
But MS also has always had a whole bunch of mature (ESRB that is) games from the start too. Nintendo doesn't have a lot. They've made an effort in it recently, with MP and ED, but it's too little too late to save the image...

And before someone brings up Conker -- that's a Rare game, and the sequel isn't going to be on the Gamecube...

[Drake Tungsten]

It IS possible to keep kiddy games without a kiddy system HOWEVER...Nintendo has completly failed.

No it's not. If the kiddie image already exists (as it did before the GC even launched), every "kiddy" game and action will be latched onto as more evidence for the preexisting view. How "kiddy" has the GC really been? Would the color of the console have been an issue if people weren't looking at it for proof of their kiddy accusations? How was Mario Sunshine anymore kiddy than every Mario game before it? It wasn't, but it fit the kiddy pattern and therefore became something it was not.

The only way Nintendo can loose the kiddy image is to either a) never make a game which can be construed as kiddy again (which eliminates almost all of Nintendo's franchises) or b) hope that the kiddy view will go away on its own. Nintendo can't do a) as it is financial suicide. So they have to hope that people will lose the stupid idea that Nintendo is for kids. I don't see that happening, so Nintendo is in some deep ****. It's a damn shame, but that's the way things are.

[Asher]

No it's not.

MS has released plenty of "kiddy" games.

Blinx and Sneakers off the top of my head...

It didn't make the Xbox seem like a kiddy system.

Sony's made Sly Cooper and a bunch of other kids-games too, it's not a kids system...

The secret is variety...

How "kiddy" has the GC really been?

That doesn't matter -- the image is here and it'll stick.

How was Mario Sunshine anymore kiddy than every Mario game before it? It wasn't, but it fit the kiddy pattern and therefore became something it was not.

For some reason the waterpack made it seem very kiddy to a lot of people...plus it wasn't a very innovative game, it was actually a pretty cut & dry platformer. To me it says Nintendo paniced about sales and didn't give the game the time it needed to become a great game. It's merely good.

[Asher]

Of course the grand irony of all of this is out of the three console makers, Sony's the only one which required BMX XXX to be censored.

Nintendo and MS released the ones with nudity and swearing and all that.

[Mr. President]

At the moment, I'd rather play a "kiddy" game like Donkey Kong Country than move five hundred settlers forward one space for sixteen hours at a time.

[Drake Tungsten]

MS has released plenty of "kiddy" games.

Blinx and Sneakers off the top of my head...

It didn't make the Xbox seem like a kiddy system.

Sony's made Sly Cooper and a bunch of other kids-games too, it's not a kids system...

The secret is variety...

No, the secret is that the Xbox didn't begin life already labeled as a "kiddy" system like the GC did. MS can release "kiddy" games because no one is looking for them, ready to jump on them as evidence that the Xbox really is "kiddy".

Pokemon has been a double-edged sword for Nintendo. It salvaged the N64 and made Nintendo a ton of money, but it was also the source of the whole "kiddy" image. The backlash against Pokemon by teens ended up staining Nintendo itself with the "kiddy" image, which has become a self-fulfilling thing. Now, franchises like Mario (which is the same as it has always been) are being labeled "kiddy" and there's nothing Nintendo can do about it. Pokemon may have saved the N64, but it may end up destroying Nintendo in a way that no one could've foresaw...

That doesn't matter -- the image is here and it'll stick.

That was my point all along. The "kiddy" image is beyond Nintendo's control, so it's stupid to blame it on them.

[Asher]

That was my point all along. The "kiddy" image is beyond Nintendo's control, so it's stupid to blame it on them.

They got the kiddy image mostly from their own actions in previous years before the Gamecube, IMO.

[Drake Tungsten]

They got the kiddy image mostly from their own actions in previous years before the Gamecube, IMO.

Yeah, they got the kiddy image by selling Pokemon games, which suddenly became the "it" thing for teens to hate. But how was Nintendo supposed to see that coming? How were they supposed to know that one game series would end up tainting all their most beloved franchises? They only saw Pokemon as the cash cow it was and didn't see the unintended consequences it would have...

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Tassadar5000
How about actually TRYING to eliminate it. Dont use stupid names (Mario "Sunshine"), dont use cartoony graphics (Celda), and dont release anything of that sort.

Why is that bad? It is a market not touched by any of the competitors. When I play games, I want to have fun, not to be snobby.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger
Why is that bad?

Well, for one, everyone is meeting their targets but Nintendo.

When the Gamecube launched, they said they'd have 16M sold by March 2003 (end of their fiscal year), then they changed it to 10M, and it looks like they're only going to get 8.5-9M. It's also losing steam compared to the competition in any market but Japan.

It sucks to be relegated to a niche market in a huge industry, especially when Nintendo is capable of so much more.

If Nintendo was more aware of this, they could have released great games as well as trying to ease the "kiddie" label.

Remember the first Super Mario Sunshine commercials...the slogan was "Clean good, dirty bad!"

[Asher]

For the first time ever, an Xbox game is #1 in Japan (Dead or Alive: Extreme Beach Volleyball).

People are even lining up to get it!

[Drake Tungsten]

So MS has finally woken up to the Japanese obsession with scantily-clad virtual women...

[Asher]

That would explain why MS paid for Tecmo's marketing budget for the game, and it was a large one at that.

[Drake Tungsten]

I think MS should go all out and start making dating-sims.

[monkspider]

Hey, I liked the name "Super Mario Sunshine"!
But I agree, PS3 is almost certainly going to suck. The next round of consoles should be interesting. XBOX should be stronger, Playstation weaker, and Nintendo an enigmatic wild card.