Dutch elections (again) tomorrow: dilemma of a Eurocommie

[Bereta_Eder]

so why did he say he had done it?

[germanos]

Originally posted by Azazel
IIRC, it was an animal rights activist.

Not only that:

He is a male
He is bald
He is the father of a baby girl

[germanos]

Originally posted by paiktis22
so why did he say he had done it?

Nope

[germanos]

Originally posted by CyberShy

Pissed it is... The old Christian Democratic arrogance is back, I see.

You obviously missed my point.
YOU are the one who's arrogant, with your simplification of parties you disagree with. Like I said, no arrogance on my side, you're allowed to have your opinion and I respect it eventhough I disagree with it.


It's something leftish people always feel like, and they will always feel that way. You guys feel like you have the superior opinion.

And that is the end of democraty.

(Italics by Germanos)

I rest my case

[Hueij]

gah, it seems that the ZOG's plan to take over the netherlands have failed. well, there is always next year.

Yeah! Then I will be able to join a real intifada!

[Bereta_Eder]

germanos do you mean that he didnt say why he did it?

thats odd...

[lord of the mark]

Help this american out.

Are the the Dutch Social Democrats explicitly "third way" like Blair, Clinton, and (sort of) Schroeder?
Are they closer to Blair on foreign policy or Schroeder???
Are their disagreements with the Socialists more on foreign policy or domestic policy??

[germanos]

Originally posted by lord of the mark
Help this american out.

Are the the Dutch Social Democrats explicitly "third way" like Blair, Clinton, and (sort of) Schroeder?
Are they closer to Blair on foreign policy or Schroeder???
Are their disagreements with the Socialists more on foreign policy or domestic policy??

#1:
Yes, very much so. Both Tony Blair as well as Gerhard Schroeder regard Wim Kok (Prime Minister of Holland from 1994-2002, and PvdA (Labour Party) to a large extent as their 'teacher', or at least as an example. (no bluffing here) Clinton apparently was quite impressed with him as well.

#2:
Closer to Blair I suppose, although I don't really now what you mean by this question. The Netherlands have a long tradition of Trans-Atlantic ties ( meaning: they are quite strong supporters of keeping European Foreign (and Economic) Policy closely tied to the USA). Other then that, the Netherlands are to a large extent the founders of the EU, as they first founded the BeNeLux (a sort of mini EU between Belgium, Netherlands and Luxemburg) that was together with France, Germany and Italy at the root of the present day EU, when the six countries founded the European Community of Coal and Steel somewhere in the 50's.

#3. Most of the differences are on Domestic issues (economic) then at Foreign Policy.
Not that they agree much on Foreign policy though...

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by germanos



#2:
Closer to Blair I suppose, although I don't really now what you mean by this question. The Netherlands have a long tradition of Trans-Atlantic ties ( meaning: they are quite strong supporters of keeping European Foreign (and Economic) Policy closely tied to the USA). Other then that, the Netherlands are to a large extent the founders of the EU, as they first founded the BeNeLux (a sort of mini EU between Belgium, Netherlands and Luxemburg) that was together with France, Germany and Italy at the root of the present day EU, when the six countries founded the European Community of Coal and Steel somewhere in the 50's.

I was thinking in terms of the attitude to the US, war on terror, Iraq, the Middle east, etc.

I realize the EU is at least as big an issue to Europeans, we Yanks tend to overlook that (or at least I do) , partly through general ethnocentrism, partly do to the high salience of the war in our current affairs.

[germanos]

Originally posted by paiktis22
germanos do you mean that he didnt say why he did it?

thats odd...

For about half a year he was completely silent on the issue.
Late last year he confessed, but still no statement why he did it.
Currently, he is in a mental institution so the shrinks can establish a psychological profile on him.

Trial is .... Ehrrrm, I don't know. I expect it to be somewhere in the fall this year.

All points to an assault by a looney rather then a thoroughly deliberate polital motivated act.
Obviously all this makes for wild speculation. From a leftist political plot to the CIA being involved .

[Lemmy]

What is Labour's designation?

PvdA

I was thinking in terms of the attitude to the US, war on terror, Iraq, the Middle east, etc.

None of the the big parties said they support the US like Blair does, however the CDA, the largest party, supports the US in keeping the pressure on Iraq.
I don't know how the PvdA feels about it, but it is probably less supportive then the CDA.

[Saint Marcus]

PvdA will only support a war if the Security Council agrees on it.

Groenlinks will only support a war if the UN General Assembly agrees on it.

SP won't support a war.

CDA is likely to support a war, with or without UN approval.

[Ned]

Originally posted by Saint Marcus
PvdA will only support a war if the Security Council agrees on it.

Groenlinks will only support a war if the UN General Assembly agrees on it.

SP won't support a war.

CDA is likely to support a war, with or without UN approval.

Saint Marcus, in the book, Band of Brothers, it is reported that the Dutch were overjoyed to be liberated by the Americans in WWII. The men of Easy Company contrasted that with the sullen resentment of the French.

I am not surprised that Holland will be there with us while France will again assume their usual stance of smug superiority.

[Lemmy]

I am not surprised that Holland will be there with us while France will again assume their usual stance of smug superiority.

If France doesn't agree, then CDA is the only party that will be there with you, and that isn't an absolute majority. Tthe PvdA, which only has 2 (of the 150 seats) less then the CDA, will want the Security Council with them, now that includes France, doens't it?
So whether the whole NL government is in or not, still depends on France atm.

[Ned]

Originally posted by Lemmy

I am not surprised that Holland will be there with us while France will again assume their usual stance of smug superiority.

If France doesn't agree, then CDA is the only party that will be there with you, and that isn't an absolute majority. Tthe PvdA, which only has 2 (of the 150 seats) less then the CDA, will want the Security Council with them, now that includes France, doens't it?
So whether the whole NL government is in or not, still depends on France atm.

This may be true, but the way things are going, it looks like Europe will have to pick sides on this one - to be with the US and the UK or to be with he French and the Germans.