IL Gov. Ryan pardones four, communtes 156 death sentences

[KrazyHorse]

Shi, if that's the case wouldn't you rather that the mistake ends with somebody in prison than with somebody murdered at the hands of the State?

[Skanky Burns]

You're damned either way, really.

[chequita guevara]

You can never return time you've mistakenly taken from a person, but if you find out you're wrong, at least they can do something what time they have left.

[Shi Huangdi]

"You can never return time you've mistakenly taken from a person, but if you find out you're wrong, at least they can do something what time they have left."

Right, but in order to be executed in this country you have to clear the entire appeals system, which makes it very unlikely you are ever going to be free again.

Hey Che any idea on if these 4 people might now want to sue the police/prosecutors office for what happened to them? If they act unethically during an investigation and you wrongly to jail because of it then you could receive financial compensation from the courts...

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
You can never return time you've mistakenly taken from a person, but if you find out you're wrong, at least they can do something what time they have left.

I'd also rather spend the rest of my life in jail than be executed. And before you bring up prison conditions regarding inmate violence, that's another thing that should be remedied...

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Shi Huangdi
Right, but in order to be executed in this country you have to clear the entire appeals system, which makes it very unlikely you are ever going to be free again.

Under the Omnibus Anti-Terrorism and Effective Death Penalty Act of 1996, convicts have an extremely short period in which to introduce newly discovered evidence which may exonerate them (it's one or two years from the date of sentencing). The appeals process was also "streamlined." The "problem" was that it was taking too long to execute prisoners, so Congress decided to make it harder for death row convicts to fight their sentences.

Hey Che any idea on if these 4 people might now want to sue the police/prosecutors office for what happened to them? If they act unethically during an investigation and you wrongly to jail because of it then you could receive financial compensation from the courts...

Under IL law, they are limited in the amount of money the can collect for wrongful imprisonment. It's an insultingly low amount, especially considering the lawyers fees that are usually racked up. Last time I looked, it was something like $35,000US. Sometimes the legislature will pass a bill granting specific indivudals more money.

AFAIK, you cannot sue individuals for wrongful prosecution. Even if you were wrongly convicted, you had recourse to due process of law. Plus, the government in its infinite wisdom feels (and probably rightly) that if the police, prosecuters, and judges were liable for making mistakes that they wouldn't be willing to carry out their jobs anymore. On the other hand, you can sue if your civil rights were violated, i.e., you were tortured or the police manufactured evidence against you or the prosecuter didn't divulge all of the information they had, etc. Judges, however, are totally exempt.

Rolando Cruz was given $75, 000, after spending, IIRC, eight years on death row. The police and prosecuters who put him behind bars were tried but eventually the case was thrown out because the prosecution failed to proove malitious intent.

If you feel like spending the money, go to www.chicagoreader.com and look up the keywords "torture" and "Burge" in the archives section. It costs $3.95 to get a copy of the articles that really helped break these cases out into the open twelve years ago. "House of Screams" was the first one, dealing mostly with the cop killer Anton Wilson. Another article a few years later dealt with Aaron Patterson and the other men who were also tortured by Burge and his crew.

Although Burge was never found responsible by a police board, he was fired from the police department over the allegations. He now lives in Florida somewhere. A jury found that though Anton Wilson had been tortured (in his law suit against the Chicago Police) and that there was substantial evidence that as many as 75 others had also been tortured by the police (and that's just going back through the Eighties, and not all the way back to when Burge started), that there was not a policy of torture in the CPD. One of those things that's kinda hard to wrap your head around. Then again, after the things I saw and the stories I heard, I wouldn't put anything past the CPD.

[MichaeltheGreat]

Originally posted by Chris 62
I never said nor cared what his party was Che.

Wrong is wrong.

Without the rule of law, society does not exsist.

The rule of law was demonstrably and repeatedly perverted and flouted by prosecutors and police.

If innocent men have been convicted, the APPEALS COURTS exsist to correct this.

Appeals courts do not normally consider new evidence, or questions of fact. They exist to resolve questions of law. The appellate courts in Illinois in many cases simply ignored the claims of prisoners who were later exonerated.

If they don't work, fix them, not ignore nearly 150 trial case decisions.

Once the system was shown to be systematically tainted with more men shown to be not guilty at all (not simply guilty of non-capital murder, but outright not guilty) than were executed, how many death sentences do you carry out that were processed through that tainted system while what needs to be fixed and how is debated for years? How many innocent men do you risk executing, so you can satisfy some people's desire for blood in return for blood?

Meanwhile, with a system so demonstrably defective, how many millions of taxpayer dollars and how many additional years of appeals do you pay for while every inmate challenges his conviction repeatedly, on the same basis as those who were freed?

I also think it's time that "pardons" be removed from elected officials, this is yet another example of the misuse of this power (Clinton was another).

Yeah, better that we fry 17 innocent men and saved the state the embarassment of demonstrating how flawed it's criminal justice system is.

If justice was denied here, the responsibility is squarely on those charged with carrying it out, who instead chose to forcibly extract false confessions, lie about how they were obtained, (or simply look the other way), tamper with evidence, suppress evidence favorable to the defense, and otherwise obstruct justice.

[rah]

While I can partialy agree with what he did, the cynic in me questions his motivation. Granted he has worked against the DP in the past, but a blanket clemency does seem a bit extreme. Maybe it's because as soon as the new Governor gets sworn in (it happens around lunch time today) they are expecting offical charges against Ryan to be submitted to the state. They haven't wanted to charge a sitting Governor and have been patiently waiting. (I'll lay bets, the charges are made before the end of the week) Granted most of the charges will be for things that happened before he became Governor, but some of them will carry into during his election and the following coverup.

This is Ryan's Smokescreen and his only chance to be remembered as anything other than a common corrupt politician. And when he get's sent to prison, he'll have a few more friends there.

[KrazyHorse]

Wow! They send white-collar criminals to maximum-security?

I guess Enron really did change things...

[SlowwHand]

Yes, this is all so lovely. Let's do a roundup of all the good.

1) Illinois courts are so corrupt they can't count on the proper legal precedures.

2) The esteemed MR. Ryan takes these steps on his way out of office, perhaps to mask impropriaties.

3) Though the residents of Illinois must favor the death penalty, they now find themselves locked into paying maintenace for these convicts.

You betcha. All-in-all, this is so positive.

[axi]

Why are some people so bloodthirsty?

As many here have said, it's better to set 100 guilty people free than condemn one innocent.

[SlowwHand]

You miss the point, Axi. There are many points, not just "releasing 1 innocent".
You just grasp that little part though, that's ok.

[rah]

And this same Governor, who four years ago loudly complained about his predecessor making political appointments during his last week in office and sticking the state with their salaries, made even more political appointments in his last few weeks then his predecessor did. Another reason to question his motivation when he said he does things for the "good of the state".

He's a common corrupt politician who just wanted to give the papers something to write about instead of his legacy of corruption.

RAH

[KrazyHorse]

Still gets a from me.

[orange]

Re: IL Gov. Ryan pardones four, communtes 156 death sentences

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
Orange walked out of Cook County Jail looking a bit dazed.

"Right now it feels great," said Orange, who was flanked by his two daughters.

Orange also had kind words and a message for Ryan.

"Thank you with all my heart and please do something for the remaining group on death row," he said.