Saddam APOLOGIZES for invading Kuwait?!

[Giancarlo]

The US hasn't lived up to its monetary commitment to the country yet, hasn't partatken in the necessary nation-building needed to prevent the country from collapsing when we are gone, and the Commander on the ground there says were are losing ground to the Taliban.

Incorrect. I think you are referring to the international community. It is only the US committing to Afghanistan. They are building roads, the Afghan military, schools, hospitals and so forth. To say otherwise would be misinformed and downright incorrect.

Now who is the incompetent one here? You.

[Giancarlo]

never mind, arguing with somebody like Gepap who tries to accuse me of having no argument is not a good thing to do.

[GePap]

Yet sadly Fez, my accusation is true. As I have said before, you are very opinionated, but unfortunitelly have failed to show an ability to back your many opinions up with a well argued post melding many facts into a cohesive piece of opinion. Why else do you think your name has become a verb?

If only a few times you did this, the amount of spamming your posts create would decline greatly.

[Giancarlo]

Your accusation is completely and utterly false.

I will say no more, because I am on probation here.

[GePap]

The way to disprove my accusation Fez would not involve anythign that would get you banned: I have nevr been banned myself, as close I have come.

Simply, taking a bunch of facts, create a piece of writing in whcih you tell us why you think the US action in Afghanistan has been a success and how such an operation in iraq could be replicated. Doing so would in no wya get ytou banned.

[Gatekeeper]

I find it somewhat ludicrous that some folks in this thread seem to be under the impression that things should be well on the road to recovery in Afghanistan a little more than a year after the Taliban were ousted from power.

Rebuilding nations can take years, folks. Were Germany, Italy and Japan back to their pre-war conditions by May and August 1946? Hell no. It would take the Marshall Plan and *YEARS* of reconstruction, re-education, et al. before those nations had the taint of Nazism, fascism and emperor-worship erased from their official policies.

Take a look at Afghanistan. It's been a wreck since the mid-1970s, and only in the last year has it had a hope of rising from the ashes and returning to stability. I politely offer the notion that maybe, just maybe, it will take *YEARS* of effort by the First World nations to bring the emancipated sack of flesh that Afghanistan currently is back to a state of health.

So before the armchair generals and armchair statesmen go about sticking hot pokers in the eyes of the real men and women, consider what I said above. Bellyaching from a computer terminal is easy. Actually being on the ground in the middle of a destroyed nation and trying to get it back on its feet is a whole 'nother story.

Regarding Iraq, their "apology" has been summarily rejected by Kuwait's government. Gee, I wonder why?

Gatekeeper

[GePap]

The US has not done all it could to help the process along. We have 6000 men in Afghanistan. We could afford to have 50,000 there to secure the whole nation and provide a safe environment for the re-building process. The failure of the US and its allies has been that. The west has also failed to make the money available to start the reconstruction.

No one expects afghnistan to be rebuilt by today, but to say the US has done its best, has done the best that could be done in this fist year, more specifically these last 6 months, is not being honest. We have not done the best we could for afghnistan. Wich then brigns up the question: will we be as good in Iraq?

Nation biulding is not cheap and easy: sadly that is what the US seems to be trying to do at this moment in Afghanistan.

[Edan]

Originally posted by GePap
The US has not done all it could to help the process along. We have 6000 men in Afghanistan

Putting in too many soldiers might not be the best idea either - we don't want them to resent our presence. (Also, isn't there additional presence by the armies of other countries?)

[mrboo123]

I agree with Gatekeeper, "Rome wasn't build in a day" (talking about the coutry, not the city) and...

Originally posted by Calc II
which god were they apologizing to, allah?

Allah is airabck (Yes, I can't spell it...) for god, and to think... I LEARN THAT IN SCHOOL!!!

[chequita guevara]

Gatekeeper, the charge is that it is not being done well. Not only that, but the American commander in Afganistan says we are losing ground to the Taliban. This isn't armchair generaling.

Bush said, "We aren't in the nation-building process." Well that's all fine and well, unless you want to secure the area to prevent that Taliban and al-Qaeada from returning after we are gone. It is in our best interests to facilitate the create of a state that can provide for the welfare and security of the people of Afganization, and we punted on second down. If this is what we can expect after taking down Hussein, then Iraq's in big trouble.

[Giancarlo]

Originally posted by GePap
The way to disprove my accusation Fez would not involve anythign that would get you banned: I have nevr been banned myself, as close I have come.

Simply, taking a bunch of facts, create a piece of writing in whcih you tell us why you think the US action in Afghanistan has been a success and how such an operation in iraq could be replicated. Doing so would in no wya get ytou banned.

Articles on reconstruction in Afghanistan:

I was not saying the operation could be replicated because it cannot be. I acknowledge the fact that the Iraqi Republican Guard is better equipped than the Taliban ever were.

Links:

http://www.defenselink.mil/news/Sep2002/n09272002_200209264.html

http://www.defenselink.mil/news/Sep2002/n09272002_200209273.html

Quote from Above article:

The secretary noted the United States' procedures for disbursing donated funds are "unduly complicated." But, he said, he's proud to report the United States has dispersed 95 percent of the money it pledged. Now it's important to "identify where the bottlenecks are" and get that money to Afghanistan where it's needed.

Two US Government sources yes. I find them more credible than CNN or any other leftist news station.

[Giancarlo]

But as that is not the issue here lets get back to Kuwait's reaction:

Kuwait's information minister, Sheik Ahmed al-Fahed al-Sabah, said the statement merely repeated Iraq's previous excuses for invading the emirate. "We believe the apology should be addressed first to the Iraqi people, who are being repressed," he said.

Saddam's dictatorship puts itself in direct confrontation with the US by denying it has weapons of mass destruction of any sort, which is a lie.

Iraq handed the United Nations a huge dossier on its military programs on Saturday, denying Iraq has any banned weapons and setting the stage for a confrontation with Washington.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/fc?cid=34&tmpl=fc&in=World&cat=Iraq

It is over for Iraq now. You anti-war peace-niks have been rejected.

[GePap]

Fez: nice to see you starting a new career as a debater, not just troller

The biggest fault of the US in Afghniastan (and the west in general, but the US is still the leader) is not moving to undercut the power of local warlords. Reconstruction need s stable political system to occur within. Afghanistan does not have that yet, and the western states do not seem to be very interested in increasing their security operations in Afghnanistan.

Also, note the getting a check in the mail, and having it cashed and used are two different things. What that offical states is that the check ahs been sent, not that the money has started to be used (the bottleneck he speaks of)

As for Iraq: the problem is not only military, it is political. Much harder than defeating the Iraqi military and any other possible resistance is dealing with the political conseuqences of going to war in the region (and how the war starts will have a big impact on that) and the atremah of the war in Iarq itself, as different groups fight for power within Iraq.

[Ned]

Why is it that only the United States gets blamed for not rebuilding Afghanistan. Isn't this a responsibity of at least allies as much as our own?

Germany, that wealthy country in the middle of Europe, has said that it support the war on terror. Where is it in Afganistan? Building roads? I'd like to know.

Where are the French, the Dutch, the Spanish?

And, even if they are not part of Nato, shouldn't the Swedes, Austrians, Swiss and the Finns help out?

[Giancarlo]

The war lords have the entire situation in their hands, the US does not. Honestly, the US will be faced with a lot of crap. They are starting to train the Afghan Army more and more.

The Iraqi Army is of no concern for me... as it is more rag-tag than the taliban... it is the republican guard I am concerned about.