Russian 'we' still crushes individual citizens

[Serb]

Originally posted by Jules
So when Hitler invaded the Soviet Union in 1941, proclaiming a racial war in the East to enslave the Slavic peoples and secure Lebensraum for the master German race in Mein Kampf, the Russians were just supposed to roll over and die?

Yes, this is what DD and esp. David Floyd would prefer to see. (you may look on my signature)

Or is this just a sneaky way to attack Russia's communist past?

No, it was personal troll against me.

Btw, DD is your crappy shop part IV already open?

Hey, Paik how do you think, perhaps it's time to warm his place again?

[Serb]

Originally posted by Dom Pedro II
Whoa!

What?
Come on say something.
DD planed this thread as Russian flag waving and I will continue the show untill will be banned.

[Dom Pedro II]

This article seems to prove the point of Russian national identity superceding individual rights by basically practicing the same methods it accuses the Russians of. It takes a few individual cases (some of which are things that the U.S. probably would have done as well) and applies very broad strokes. The fiasco at the theater therefore means that it is the fault of an entirely society rather than the mistake of a few individuals. It talks about Russians in the most abstract terms possible, which I think is always folly when talking about a country and its people, and backs the conclusion with specific instances without taking the other variables into account.

And the "moon rock" example can be tossed out for the simple fact that it is from the period of the Soviet regime... you can't argue that nothing has changed after a regime change if you base it on situations still within the old regime.

I would go as far as to say that the reasoning used by this author is the same as that used by the Arabs who committed the atrocities of 9-11. It presumes that the specific actions of a country's government automatically reflect how the society functions... thereby blurring the line between individual and nation. The author's argument is hypocritical.

[Serb]

The fiasco at the theater ...
WTF
Fiasco for whom? For terrorists who were neutralized before they blow-up the whole building? Yes, for those guys it was total fiasco.
For Russia it was victory. Almost 800 hostages were saved. Everyone of them count this day as their second birthday and saying that specnaz returned them from realm of the dead.
Perhaps somebody could point me another such operation let's see- huge building, huge amount of terrorists- 50, huge amount of hostages about- 900, high concentration of hostages about 900 people in one single auditorium AND AMONG THEM 25 suicide bombers each carrying about 2kg of explosives, two HUGE bombs powerfull enough not only to destroy whole theater, but also to inflict huge damage in radius of 1 km.
If you'll show to me special services of which country managed to solve situation, disable more them 30 bombs, 50 terrorists and lost less then 15% of hostages in such difficult circumstsnces, I'll admit that special services of this country are better then Russian specnaz.
Go ahead and show me one single exmple how similar situation was solved with less casulaties among hostages.
And please no bull**** about "what if", "what that" and the same crap.
Facts, only facts please.
Untill somebody will do it, I'll consider talks about fiasco as crappy cheap trolling, combined aroggance and ignorance, anti-Russian whine about red-ass evil commies and the same ****.

have a nice day.

[Serb]

Originally posted by Azazel
I am not talking about the Nord-Ost Fiasco, but about the apartment block bombings several years ago.

Blah...blah...blah...
Call to relatives and ask them.
During three days of hostages crisis ALL TV chanels showed the situation on-line. EVERY MINUTE.
As for bombings, it was 3 years ago, but iirc begining of resque opreation was ahown on-line and later there was emregency TV news quite often. And btw, it happen at night time when our country was sleeping, after explosion what do you think TV should show on-line, ruins?
They showed them and showed how resque operation is going. What else they could shown?

[Jules]

Originally posted by Serb
You Americans, never were invaded during your history, never your lands saw major destructions which war and invasion brings.

Not entirely correct. During the War of 1812, we were invaded by the British from Canada. Washington DC and several other cities were burned to the ground. And the Civil War was pretty destructive too, especially in the South, with a half million dead.

But you're right that your nation has a much longer history and has suffered a great deal more from war. I for one am glad that Russia is still standing strong. I don't think it's necessary for us to force our culture down your throat in order for our two countries to get along.

[Serb]

Thanks.
You are right of course, my 'never were invaded' is incorect exaggeration, but I'm still absolutely sure that people of our countries have different mentality, because of different circumstances our coutries lived and it's absolutely normal.

Btw, where is the starter of this Ruso-bashing? Come-on DinoDoc, show yourself.

[VetLegion]

Yes, we are different SO WHAT?

like hell you are

Yes, the life of individual cost nothing in compare with life of our motherland and

if you think so ok, but dont decieve yourselves all russians do. I bet most do but only if we are not talking about their life

majority of us will sacrifice their lifes if it will be needed to save our country.

bull****

This is a Russian mentality, a mentality of people who lived in extremly dangerous conditions during centuries. Try to find me another country as Russia which were attacked by enemies so frequent during its history

blah blah blah, find me an area in europe that didnt see plenty of war and misery

We'll never be like you DD, we worship to Rodina, you worship to allmighty dollar.

you have been brainwashed. you see, you worship the dollar too

and tales of ancient glory dont feed people you know.

russia has no more 'we' mentality then any other country in the world.

I agree that russian govt. systems always encouraged uniformity of people, and people learned to go with the flow, not to express their opinions, not to be too noticeable etc

the highest straw is the first to get cut after all

but this is not natural or voluntary. the russians are as diverse and as individual as any other peoples

[Bereta_Eder]

Good ending Croat.

[muxec]

Ñîþç íåðóøèìûé ðåñïóáëèê ñâîáîäíûõ
Ñïëîòèëà íàâåêè âåëèêàÿ Ðóñü!
Äà çäðàâñòâóåò ñîçäàííûé âîëåé íàðîäîâ
Âåëèêèé ìîãó÷èé Ñîâåòñêèé Ñîþç!

Ïð.
Ñëàâüñÿ îòå÷åñòâî íàøå ñâîáîäíîå!
Äðóæáû íàðîäîâ íàäåæíûé îïëîò
Ïàðòèÿ Ëåíèíà ñèëà íàðîäíàÿ
Íàñ ê òîðæåñòâó êîììóíèçìà âåäåò!

Ñêâîçü ãðîçû ñèÿëî íàì ñîëíöå ñâîáîäû
È Ëåíèí âåëèêèé íàì ïóòü îçàðèë
Íà ïðàâîå äåëî îí ïîäíÿë íàðîäû
Íà òðóä è íà ïîäâèãè íàñ âäîõíîâèë

Ïð.
Ñëàâñÿ îòå÷åñòâî íàøå ñâîáîäíîå!
Äðóæáû íàðîäîâ íàäåæíûé îïëîò
Ïàðòèÿ Ëåíèíà ñèëà íàðîäíàÿ
Íàñ ê òîðæåñòâó êîììóíèçìà âåäåò!

 ïîáåäå âåëèêèõ èäåé êîììóíèçìà
Ìû âèäèì ãðÿäóùåå íàøåé ñòðàíû
è êðàñíîìó çíàìåíè íàøåé îò÷èçíû
Ìû áóäåì âñåãäà áåççàâåòíî âåðíû!

Ïð.
Ñëàâüñÿ îòå÷åñòâî íàøå ñâîáîäíîå!
Äðóæáû íàðîäîâ íàäåæíûé îïëîò
Ïàðòèÿ Ëåíèíà ñèëà íàðîäíàÿ
Íàñ ê òîðæåñòâó êîììóíèçìà âåäåò!

[muxec]

Ñîþç íåðóøèìûé äîðîã ñ äóðàêàìè
Îñòàâèë íàì ãèìí ýòîò, ñëîâíî êëåéìî,
Ïî âîëå ïðèäóðêîâ, ÷òî èçáðàíû íàìè,
Ìû áóäåì âñòàâàòü ïîä ëþáîå äåðüìî.

Ñëàâüñÿ, îòå÷åñòâî, íàøå ñòàáèëüíîå,
Hàøèõ ïàðòèéöåâ ïîñëåäíèé îïëîò.
Ñèëà ÷èíîâíèêîâ, ñèëà äåáèëüíàÿ
Hàñ ê ðàçîðåíüþ íàäåæíî âåäåò!

Ñêâîçü ãîäû íàì ñâåòÿò Åæîâ è ßãîäà
È Áåðèÿ ÿñíûé íàì ïóòü îçàðèë,
Hàçâàâ ïîë-Ðîññèè âðàãàìè íàðîäà,
Îí ãëàâíîé èäååþ íàñ îäàðèë.

Ñëàâüñÿ, îòå÷åñòâî, íàøå ðàçäîðíîå -
Îáðàç âðàãà - íàø íàä¸æíûé îïëîò.
Håíàâèñòü âå÷íàÿ - ñèëà çàäîðíàÿ,
×òî íàñ âïåðåä òî è äåëî âåäåò!

Hàñ Áðåæíåâ ñêâîçü çâåçäû âçðàñòèë è âçëåëåÿë,
À ñ íèì Øåâàðäíàäçå, Àëèåâ - ÖÊ!
Ìû ïîìíèì, êàê ðàíüøå ñ òðèáóí ìàâçîëåÿ
Hàì äåëàëè ðó÷êîé: ïîêà, ìîë, ïîêà.

Ñëàâüñÿ, îòå÷åñòâî, íàøå ðàçäîëüíîå,
 ìèðå êðóïíåå çåìëè íå ñûñêàòü.
Ìíîãî ïàðòèéíàÿ âëàñòü ïðîèçâîëüíàÿ,
Áóäåò êîìó, ÷òî îñòàëîñü, ðàçäàòü.

Hàì Ëåíèí ïðåäð¸ê âëàñòü êóõàðêè ñ ñîñèñêîé,
Ê íàì Ñòàëèí áåç âèçû ÿâëÿëñÿ è âîò,
Ïðîäðàâøèñü òåïåðü ñêâîçü ïàðòèéíûå ñïèñêè,
Hàñ ìîæåò âîçãëàâèòü ëþáîé èäèîò!

[muxec]

Serb, íåêîòîðûé ëþäè òèïà ÄèíîÄîêà ëþáÿò ðàññóæäàòü î ñòðàíàõ ê êóëüòóðå áûòó è ôèëîñîôèè êîòîðûõ íå îòíîñÿòñÿ è íè ìàëåéøåãî ïîíÿòèÿ íå èìåþò.

All, simply people who drink a lot of vodka are more likely to say 'we'.

[Az]

Serb, ya vsetaki dumayu chto ne sovsem pravilno operirovali.

[Jules]

Speak English please.

[DinoDoc]

Mission accomplished. I got more fish to take the bait than I had hoped.

Originally posted by Serb
Go ahead and show me one single exmple how similar situation was solved with less casulaties among hostages.

You could have told the doctors what the gas was and how to counteract its effects and there would have been a lot less casualties among the hostages. But of course, they were irrelevent when compared to the value of State secrets.