Should East Europe countries be thankful to Soviet Union?

[Mihai]

...and lives at the end of the world...

[Saras]

Be careful not to fall off after too many fosters :P

[Heresson]

Hmmm…wait a minute, it could be only one man…that’s right!!!…. Heresson
is here
Where have you been so long? Perhaps was planning how exactly you will execute me?

I'm now back on my studies and I can't use internet as often as I could at home.

I will not argue about 1921. From past experience I know that it's useless.

Obviously; You can't fight justified Polish claims.

Was it Soviet Union? Do you remember when it was? Perhaps it was young Soviet state, perhaps it was at the same time when 'borders weren't settled'? Perhaps it was in chaos of civil war, a war between Red and White? And if you think that White government was legal government, I don’t see why the same couldn’t be said about Red.

Both weren't legal. Kiereñski was.

I'm aware that in the case of WWII Poland, it was the Brits (and French?) that made promises. I was using it as an example of promises causing expectations. I did not mean to imply that the USA broke promises to Poland.

President Roosevelt in order to get Polish votes in elections, promised us to argue with Soviets about our eastern borders and gouverment - not before the war, but during. He was having appointements with Poles and photos under a map of Poland with borders from before the war
even two years after He agreed on Soviet claims. If not Molotow's faux pas, Polish gouverment wouldn't know the truth up to the end of the war.

I've talked about current days, not about medieval period. In current days it was Polish minority which was assimilated into Lithuanian culture, not vice-versa obviously.

That You have got back to the previous language doesn't mean You've abandoned previous, Polish, culture

There was no Lithuanian SS legion. Lithuanians mostly dodged the rallies and took to the woods to fight against BOTH soviet and nazi armies;

There was. There was just one occupied nation that didn't have its own SS Legion - Poles.

[Saras]

Heresson - I dare you to find a link on a number and commanding officers of that "Lithuanian" SS legion.

[Saras]

"Unlike her Estonian and Latvian neighbors though, Lithuania never provided Germany with a National Legion during WWII, although from the very start of the German occupation quite a few volunteers came forward. "

http://www.feldgrau.com/lith.html

Just a quick Google search

[Heresson]

I can't give You a link, I'm not very into the net, I never
give links and stuff... Books perhaps... But I'll try to ask someone if I have a chance.
Lithuanians helped the nazis to fight Polish partisants that's for sure.

[Arrian]

Heresson,

Interesting info on Roosevelt, btw. Thanks for that. One of the faults of democracy is that politicians will say anything to get elected. I'm with Churchill: it's the worst form of government, except for all the others.

-Arrian

[Saras]

Heresson, i think you should say "I was wrong" and just swallow your pride I mean, really, that's just sooo lame an attempt at saving face

Oh, and btw, there were Pollacks too fighting for the nazis. And Jews, and Americans, and Brits. Sheesh!

[chequita guevara]

Pollack is a derrogatory word in English. Pole is the correct word.

[DanS]

It is?

[Arrian]

Yeah, I'd say it is. At least mildly so.

-Arrian

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by DanS
It is?

It's how Archie used it when talking about Meathead.

[Wilderess]

I am now repeating myself, but the issue is worth it.

Originally posted by Alexander’s Horse
The downsides were the same as those for Soviet rule in Russia - a lack of personal freedom, a lower standard of living and slower rate of economic growth than in the West and, most of all, foreign occupation and Stalinist repression.

But it was much much better than what went before under German domination.

The what if -fantasy starts from the point of the Nazis being beaten. For THAT we all are thankful to the Soviet as well as to all the countries that fought against Nazis. (Finland played a selfish game here, but somehow I can’t force myself to think we should have done otherwise, considering what would have resulted from allying with Soviet Russia.)

If we now fantasize from that point on, the options to be compared are: 1) Eastern Europe starts to rebuild as independent countries, 2) Soviet occupation in Eastern Europe.

AH’s allegation that the ”lower standard of living and slower rate of economic growth than in the West and, most of all, foreign occupation and Stalinist repression” ”was much much better than what went before” is true, but was it much much better than independent Eastern Europe?

Originally posted by Alexander’s Horse
Oh no I wouldn't have wanted to live in the Eastern Bloc either

And yet you say the East Europeans should be grateful? The Russians have no reason to be grateful to the communist regime. The fact that the country is near a chaos now is just another reason for NOT to be grateful.

Another interesting what if –thread would be what if Lenin had not won the revolution in Russia? What would that giant be like, would there still be a czar and serfs, or would there be a president in a democratic country – or a democratic monarchy with a czar without any power, just an icon like the Brits and the Swedes have?

[Mihai]

Soviet Union didn't fight the nazis to eliberate East Europe, but because Germany attacked it.

For example, romanians are thankful to France for her suport in 1859 when Wallachia and Moldavia united. France may had her own interest in that, but the result was only good for us.

If Nazi Germany won, it could be worst, but I cannot see why I had to be thankful to that dog who bite me after he chased away the wolf.

[Wilderess]

Originally posted by Mihai
Soviet Union didn't fight the nazis to eliberate East Europe, but because Germany attacked it.

I know.