Should we fight? A liberal's view.

[Sava]

Saddam isn't any more of a threat to the US than he was right after the Gulf War. Even if Saddam gets nukes, how's he going to hit the US? If you're scared of a terrorist nuke, invading Iraq still isn't the solution to stopping that threat. Domestic security is more important than invading Iraq. Saddam is bad, but not worth the effort because he's not a threat to us.

[Odin]

Originally posted by Sava
Saddam isn't any more of a threat to the US than he was right after the Gulf War. Even if Saddam gets nukes, how's he going to hit the US? If you're scared of a terrorist nuke, invading Iraq still isn't the solution to stopping that threat. Domestic security is more important than invading Iraq. Saddam is bad, but not worth the effort because he's not a threat to us.

I second that motion.

[Sava]

to Mr. Bush:

For ****'s sake, if you're going to waste a billion dollars a day fighting some stupid baby-Hitler-wannabe-desert rodent, can you at least send me a million?

[Capt Dizle]

Hussein is not rational. Hussein acts unfettered by reality. If Hussein had nukes there is a good possibility that he would become aggressive again. Why wouldn't he? Based on his record he is aggressive whenever he can be.

This would destabilize the region. More importantly a nuclear armed Saddam could strike Israel. Arguments that Saddam is not a threat to the US are irrelevant. The US supports Israel.

[notyoueither]

Who would rather clean up the mess after Saddam uses a nuke? Anyone?

[KrazyHorse]

Saddam's years (read decades) away from gaining access to enough weapons-grade material to build even a primitive nuke. He'd probably do better building up a conventional missile force which can be launched en masse.

[notyoueither]

There are a lot of conflictiong claims about that. With the state of the Russian Strategic Forces, I'd tend to err on the side of proliferation being the rule.

Do we want to be wrong?

[KrazyHorse]

So we invade every country that's been bad and might develop nukes? I hate to break it to you, but that adds up to a few dozen...

Saddam's a paper tiger.

[Drake Tungsten]

Hussein is not rational. Hussein acts unfettered by reality.

Saddam's years (read decades) away from gaining access to enough weapons-grade material to build even a primitive nuke.

Great, now we're getting completely unsubstantiated claims from both the lefties and the righties. God forbid people stick to things that they actually know...

[notyoueither]

No, not every country. Just the one led by a mentally imbalanced dictator who shows negative regard for human life and prizes human suffering highly. The same guy who has demonstrated an eagerness to invade his neighbours and to lob weapons at other nations not involved in hostilities in some insane hope of accomplishing some unfathomable goal.

There is nothing paper about that guy. Underestimating him might be one of the biggest mistakes that the West could ever make.

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten

Hussein is not rational. Hussein acts unfettered by reality.

Saddam's years (read decades) away from gaining access to enough weapons-grade material to build even a primitive nuke.

Great, now we're getting completely unsubstantiated claims from both the lefties and the righties. God forbid people stick to things that they actually know...

Do you know how difficult it is to run an isotopic separation facility? Do you know how much raw uranium you need to build a bomb that way? Do you know how much neutron (or neutrino, for that matter) flux is caused by an operating breeder reactor if you want to build a Pu bomb? Do you know how easy it is to see this?

[KrazyHorse]

The bull**** coming out about Saddam being 3 years from building a nuke is almost laughable...if it wasn't being used to attempt to justify a war.

[notyoueither]

How can you be sure it's bull?

[Drake Tungsten]

Do you have inside knowledge of the Iraqi nuclear arms program? Are you privy to classified intelligence information? Do you have a list of every black market purchase Iraq has made in recent years? If not, then you know jack ****, just like the rest of us. Your knowledge of the process required to build a nuclear bomb does not give you any insight whatsoever into what is actually happening in Iraq...

[KrazyHorse]

I can't...but I can be reasonably certain.

From what they're saying, he's only just now attempting to acquire the right pieces to make a gaseous diffusion (IIRC) separation facility. That's step 1 out of a hundred. It's a damn time-consuming process (IIRC, the U has to be run through a few dozen times before it attains sufficient concentration of U235...and this gives a final yield of ~1% of initial sample). When the US did it for the Manhatten project, it took them 3 years of 24-hour operation at 3(?) giant plants to get enough U235 for 1 bomb.

Saddam doesn't have the kind of resources the US did in WWII. He's got to scrounge for spare parts if these same reports are correct. He might be able to produce U235 on micro levels...but never on scale of 10-20 kg like he needs.