Most evil American political leader ever?

[David Floyd]

Woodrow Wilson forced America into WW1, costing over 120,000 US lives. For that alone, he counts as one of the worst in my book.

[Chris 62]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov
Bad and evil aren't the same. Both may have been incompetent, but evil? nah.

Out of your league, as usual Boris.
Buchanan let Bleeding Kansas go on, and let civil war happen, and Johnson allowed the Jim Crow law types of the South to run wild, destroying the reconstruction, setting civil rights for blacks back 100 years.
Not evil?
Get real.

Since Clinton was on the "Most Evil Leader Ever" poll, and Bush wasn't, I'd take it your lack of complaining about that is more proof of your "centrist" beliefs?

If you would bother to remove your head from your ass and stop your personal carping, you might notice I didn't say Clinton was evil, ever.
He was the king of doing nothing.
Someday you may understand I'm not anti-gay, not a conservative, and not an enemy.

And Dubya has done plenty wrong as President, depending on your point of view.

Why don't you list those little things?

[Chris 62]

Originally posted by David Floyd
Two major things.
First of all, large-scale government interference in the economy (trust busting and the like).
Secondly, his big stick policy and military buildups.

Neither of those are bad things, Floydy.

And third, of course, he had McKinley assassinated

Well, it WAS his state.

Just remembered another of my favorite evil US leaders, LBJ.

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by David Floyd
Woodrow Wilson forced America into WW1, costing over 120,000 US lives. For that alone, he counts as one of the worst in my book.

"Forced?" Not quite. American popular sentiment was in favor of entering the war by 1917. We didn't go kicking and screaming...

[loinburger]

I don't see how George Jr. could have more votes than George Sr., seeing as how George Jr. hasn't started or joined any wars.

I also don't see how Millard Fillmore has zero votes, seeing as how he ate kittens.

[Chris 62]

LBJ and Kennedy are two of the more vile US presidents, the first had a nasty habit of pushing the Russians to the brink of nuclear war (and the morals of a stray dog), and that smuck LBJ pushed the US into the Vietnam disaster.

[David Floyd]

Chris,

destroying the reconstruction

I'd define "destroying Reconstruction" as a very good thing, personally.

Neither of those are bad things, Floydy.

Not in your opinion, but they certainly are in mine.

Just remembered another of my favorite evil US leaders, LBJ.

At least we agree on something - I hate LBJ.

Boris,

"Forced?" Not quite. American popular sentiment was in favor of entering the war by 1917.

Of course it was, because of Wilson's propaganda, and because of the Lusitania incident, which Wilson allowed to happen and was responsible for.

[David Floyd]

Chris - yeah, I forgot about JFK. In addition to having some of the looser morals compared to other Presidents, he could have caused nuclear war.

Honestly, what was wrong with Russian missiles in Cuba? For crying out loud we had them in Turkey and Germany - what's the difference?

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by Chris 62
Out of your league, as usual Boris.
Buchanan let Bleeding Kansas go on, and let civil war happen, and Johnson allowed the Jim Crow law types of the South to run wild, destroying the reconstruction, setting civil rights for blacks back 100 years.
Not evil?
Get real.

Nope, just impotent and incompetent. Buchanan and Johnson were spineless puppets, kinda like Reagan but without the gift of charm. I would say being "most evil" would require decisive action towards evil purposes, not being powerless to stop the evil actions of others.

If you would bother to remove your head from your ass and stop your personal carping, you might notice I didn't say Clinton was evil, ever.
He was the king of doing nothing.

I didn't accuse you of saying such a thing. I was just pointing out how curious it was such a "centrist" would feel so compelled to whine about Bush's inclusion on this list but not Clinton's inclusion on the other...

Someday you may understand I'm not anti-gay, not a conservative, and not an enemy.

1 & 3 I've never accused you of. I just think you're in the closet on 2...

Why don't you list those little things?

I have on plenty of other threads, but they'd be off topic here, as I didn't vote for Bush as being evil. I was just pointing out that his not doing anything wrong is based on your opinion of what the right and wrong actions were. He was certainly wrong, IMO, when he blatantly stole the 2000 election, but again, that's off-topic.

We need to get you to a spa or something for relaxion.

[Chris 62]

He still had delusions of retaking Cuba, remember?

Soviet forces there might make that difficult.

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by David Floyd
Of course it was, because of Wilson's propaganda, and because of the Lusitania incident, which Wilson allowed to happen and was responsible for.

Well, a lot of propaganda was also coming from Britain in the U.S. Papers. So was German propaganda.

Wilson was responsible for the sinking of the Lusitania? Funny, I thought it was the torpedos fired by the German U-boat. Did they have some sort of secret orders from Wilson to fire on the Lucy?

You can possibly blame the British Admiralty for the sinking, but Wilson is a very big stretch to get the blame for it. Did he capitalize on it? Yes. Cause it? Come on...

[David Floyd]

Well of course, from our (well, his) point of view Russian missiles were a provocation, while US missiles were defensive, and that invading Cuba would be perfectly acceptable, while a Russion invasion of Germany would not.

[Chris 62]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov Nope, just impotent and incompetent. Buchanan and Johnson were spineless puppets, kinda like Reagan but without the gift of charm. I would say being "most evil" would require decisive action towards evil purposes, not being powerless to stop the evil actions of others.

You need to read more , especially about Johnson, the first president ever impeached.
As for Reagan being a puppet, your WAY off.
He was the puppet master, just look at his history for proof of that.

I didn't accuse you of saying such a thing. I was just pointing out how curious it was such a "centrist" would feel so compelled to whine about Bush's inclusion on this list but not Clinton's inclusion on the other...

First, commenting on somthing isn't a whine, I leave that to you.
Second, did I post in that thread?
I haven't even read it, and your making a comparison and value judgement based on that???

1 & 3 I've never accused you of. I just think you're in the closet on 2...

Not at all on #2, as a writer and historian, FACTS are all that matter, which is why I find constant Bush Carping so ridculous, since it isn't based on fact.

I have on plenty of other threads, but they'd be off topic here, as I didn't vote for Bush as being evil. I was just pointing out that his not doing anything wrong is based on your opinion of what the right and wrong actions were. He was certainly wrong, IMO, when he blatantly stole the 2000 election, but again, that's off-topic.

An unfounded accusation, as has been proven numerous times.
That's just sour grapes, dear Boris.

We need to get you to a spa or something for relaxion.

I'd love it, but it's hardly needed.
However, a dose of objectivity for you might be in order.

[David Floyd]

Well, a lot of propaganda was also coming from Britain in the U.S. Papers. So was German propaganda.

Funny you should mention British and German propaganda. British propaganda included the probable manufacture of the Zimmerman note, and German propaganda included an attempt to put a warning in various US newspapers that the Lusitania was a valid war target, seeing as how it was a British flagged vessel traveling in a war zone carrying munitions.

Wilson was responsible for the sinking of the Lusitania? Funny, I thought it was the torpedos fired by the German U-boat. Did they have some sort of secret orders from Wilson to fire on the Lucy?

No, he was responsible for the Americans traveling on the vessel being unaware that it was a German target, due to his suppression of German warnings.

You can possibly blame the British Admiralty for the sinking, but Wilson is a very big stretch to get the blame for it. Did he capitalize on it? Yes. Cause it? Come on...

No, Wilson is not responsible for the sinking - but I'd say he's largely to blame for the presence of Americans on board, and certainly responsible for the presence of munitions.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by David Floyd
British propaganda included the probable manufacture of the Zimmerman note,

I was under the impression that Zimmerman admitted his authorship of the telegraph.