How stupid can our(U.S.) goverment be:

[Vesayen]

Originally posted by Kepler
The standard conservative line is that anyone acting in interests larger than themselves -- civil rights advocates, environmentalists, union leaders, social workers, teachers -- must be doing it for cynical political purposes. Since conservatives use government for perpetuating power and grafting personal fortunes, it isn't surprising they accuse everyone of the same moral bankruptcy. They're a cop on the take who excuses himself by claiming "everybody's doing it," and slandering those who actually do their work in a professional, effective manner.

Well said.....I volunteer time at the local beach cleaning it up after the tourist trash it every weekend.....I must be trying to help the enviroment, because I wish to take over the world, or make lots of money picking up the trash, right?

[Sava]

Originally posted by Kepler
The standard conservative line is that anyone acting in interests larger than themselves -- civil rights advocates, environmentalists, union leaders, social workers, teachers -- must be doing it for cynical political purposes. Since conservatives use government for perpetuating power and grafting personal fortunes, it isn't surprising they accuse everyone of the same moral bankruptcy. They're a cop on the take who excuses himself by claiming "everybody's doing it," and slandering those who actually do their work in a professional, effective manner.

[right wing rant]

sounds like more commie talk to me, boys... let's put him on our black list and detain him... he obviously doesn't believe in our country, under god!

[/right wing rant]

[Sava]

The standard conservative line is that anyone acting in interests larger than themselves -- civil rights advocates, environmentalists, union leaders, social workers, teachers -- must be doing it for cynical political purposes. Since conservatives use government for perpetuating power and grafting personal fortunes, it isn't surprising they accuse everyone of the same moral bankruptcy.

SIG TIME!

[DinoDoc]

Sava: Why would your proposal be any better than Bush's? Let's try to leave what you think might possibly, maybe happen at some future time out of the arguement to insure that I don't get more of the same exact response.

[red_jon]

Dinodoc - granted I don't know much about this issue and so won't comment on this particular proposal, per se, I would personally take any environmental schemes from the Bush administration with a pinch of salt. He did want to drill for oil in Alaska, remember.

[drake]

The standard leftist line is that anyone acting in interests larger than themselves -- IE government -- must be doing it for cynical political purposes.

[Sava]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
Sava: Why would your proposal be any better than Bush's? Let's try to leave what you think might possibly, maybe happen at some future time out of the arguement to insure that I don't get more of the same exact response.

I'm not talking about possible futures here. My solution (well not really mine) is based upon what I have learned from reading literature and online sources that have experience in the forest preserve and fire prevention service. Bush's is a plan devised by his corporate logging constituents, no different from the energy plan written by Enron.

[Sava]

Originally posted by red_jon
Dinodoc - granted I don't know much about this issue and so won't comment on this particular proposal, per se, I would personally take any environmental schemes from the Bush administration with a pinch of salt. He did want to drill for oil in Alaska, remember.

That was also a joke. The amount of oil that can be obtained from raping Alaska is the same amount of oil that could have been saved by raising the manual EPA Fuel Consumption minimum by 2 MPG. A bill that was defeated by Republicans (backed by the auto and oil industries).

[DinoDoc]

Argumentum ad verecundiam and argumentum ad hominem all in one post. I'm impressed.

[drake]

Theres good fires and bad fires. How are you proposing preventing bad fires?

And no it isn't as simple as managing underbrush in forested communities. Something much more drastic is needed.

Want to protect the forests? Teach more people responsibility. Most fires after all are caused by irresponsible people.

[Sava]

Simple pleasures for simple minds, eh?

[Arrian]

Generally, I think we do too little to safeguard the environment, but it looks like you guys picked the wrong proposal to rant about. You would be more effective if you concentrated on stuff nobody argues is good: pollution by corporations that leaches into soil and groundwater and ends up killing people. That's not nearly as nebulous as global warming or the concept of Gaia.

I work in insurance... environmental claims to be specific. There are some truely ugly sites out there, LOADED with contamination, that pose a genuine risk to human health. Some of them have been documented as such for a decade or more before cleanup commenced, for various reasons... ultimately, this is a policy flaw. ***** about THAT (using facts and logic), and you may go far...

-Arrian

[Guest]

I'm from Australia and I can tell you one thing that "mother" nature has drilled into us with GRIM FINALITY. You ignore thinning the forests at your own peril.

This is not environmental, it's about lives.

Nature is not a mother, and it will kill you at the first opportunity you give it.

If you don't believe me, I challenge you to go out into the Australian outback without any preparation and see just how forgiving "mother" nature is.

[Vesayen]

Originally posted by CICSMaster
I'm from Australia and I can tell you one thing that "mother" nature has drilled into us with GRIM FINALITY. You ignore thinning the forests at your own peril.

This is not environmental, it's about lives.

Nature is not a mother, and it will kill you at the first opportunity you give it.

If you don't believe me, I challenge you to go out into the Australian outback without any preparation and see just how forgiving "mother" nature is.

Dont live in a part of the world with the most poisonous animals per acre and you wont have a problem.........they were there first: dont ***** lol.

[Az]

Cleared rain forest becomes infertile very quickly because there are few nutrients in the rainforest.

not if one uses Chemical fertilizers , and pesticids

On topic: how is that logging going to occur? are they going to selectively chop down some trees inside the forests , but generally leave the forests intact, or are they going to clear entire patches of land?