German court rules Nazi reprisal executions justified

[Ecthy]

Common sense, my friend, common sense.

There's a difference between troops in landing boats and troops in trains.

[Boris Godunov]

A group of British soldiers was storming some hilltop German machine gun post in Northern Italy (I think), and the Germans were decimating them with machine gun fire. Finally, through sheer numbers, they got to the top of the ridge. The Germans all threw up their hands and surrendered. The Brits said, "Too late, mates," and shot them all.

[Dr Strangelove]

The Battle of Normandy was won on the roads and rails of France. Allied planes destroyed most of the equipment bound for the front lines and decimated the troops on the march. (You guys invented this type of attack you know.) If allied planes had not been able to prevent men and eqipment from reaching Normandy you'd be speaking German right now!

Troop trains are usually protected by guns and artillery, they're not naked.

In your opinion is it permissable to blow up the tracks? Isn't that as likely to be as fatal as shooting the men on the train? If you just shoot at the cars at least the men have a chance for the train to roll out of range. If it is not permissable to destroy the train, then you're effectively saying that interdiction of supplies and replacements is not a legitimate means of waging war.

[Ecthy]

you can always storm the train

[Ecthy]

tough example, Boreus

[Dr Strangelove]

Originally posted by Ecthelion
you can always storm the train

You can run 30 to 60 miles/hour?
I mean, you can run 45 to 96 Kilometers/hour?

[Ecthy]

set a bomb on the track

and when the train has come to a halt: storm it. offer imprisonment. if they kindly say no, move bac. they will let you. then have a fight.

oh wait, the last part was so 18th century

Boris, that example is really... odd....

[Ecthy]

it made me think

[Dr Strangelove]

Originally posted by Ecthelion
set a bomb on the track

and when the train has come to a halt: storm it. offer imprisonment. if they kindly say no, move bac. they will let you. then have a fight.

oh wait, the last part was so 18th century

Boris, that example is really... odd....

Following your example one should not fire on a column of marching soldiers either. One should stand up and shout a request for their surrender first.

If the train wrecks at full speed most of the troops on it will be killed anyway.

Like I said, troop trains are usually armed anyway. All it takes is a flat car with a machine gun or two.

[Boris Godunov]

I think it's a tough one, Ecthy. On the one hand, the Germans were doing their duty, defending a hill they were ordered to defend.

However, if you're a Brit and you watch your buddies get mowed down in droves, fight tooth-and-nail to take the hill, and then the Germans just throw up their hands and surrender...well, what are you going to do? The Germans knew their position was hopeless. They had plenty of opportunities to surrender before the Brits reached the top.

It's just another example of why war really, really sucks.

[Dr Strangelove]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov
I think it's a tough one, Ecthy. On the one hand, the Germans were doing their duty, defending a hill they were ordered to defend.

I think that there is a "hors de combat" clause in the Geneva Convention that excuses such actions.

[GePap]

Ruling is wrong

This, of course, is a terrible ruling. I agree with Che on this, attacks on civilians wrong, atatcks on occupying forces OK. The way for the occupying forces should be the same: attacks on civilian, or acts of communal punishment against the occupied population wrong, trying to arrest those that carried out the acts against the occupying forces fine. Since hose killed were already prisoners, thus non-combatants, what happened was murder. Hopefully a higger court will overturn this hiddeous ruling.

[faded glory]

"The Battle of Normandy was won on the roads and rails of France. Allied planes destroyed most of the equipment bound for the front lines and decimated the troops on the march"

My grandfather told me this, he was a german soldier well behind the beach. The Resistance cut the lines of communication to HQ so well that his unit sent couriers on kubelwagons on 100 miles trips. Thats how well the resistance cut the lines.

[Ned]

Doctor Strangelove, Desert Storm turned into a fiasco because our Apache helicopters butchered fleeing columns of Iraqi troops. This action was witnessed by the entire world on TV. It's so sickened Powell and others that they called a halt prematurely and allowed the Republican guard to escape.

It may be one thing to shoot the locomotives of a troop train. It is quite another to massacre every soldier on a train. We saw one example of that in the movie Lawrence of Arabia. You could see the horror in Lawrence eyes and expression.

When an assault is made by partisans on a convoy of troops, there is no possibility of taking prisoners. Either the partisans wipe out the troops in the convoy, or they retreat. I think the new ICC would tell them that they must retreat.

But back to Desert Storm. I would think that butchering a column of fleeing troops must be and should be illegal even by uniformed troops, but more so by partisans.

[GePap]

Simple rules

I don't think the codes for wht is and isn't allowed should be that complex:

Troops moving towards the battlefield to fight, fair game, troops that have surrendered or are fleeing, not fair game. If you are running away, that makes it seem to me that you are no longer a combatant.