Sharon Acts!

[Panag]

Originally posted by Eli


What core?



And who will that be?



Yeah, very nice. Dead soldier in Kalkiliya, 4+ killed in Jerusalem 20 minutes ago... Yupee.

hi ,

the core of 3000 (+-) people who like to do nothing more then to make war , the leaders , .....

who , well , all the refugees we have from all over the middle east , and two , all the people who come to support their pal brothers , .....
including some eyropeans and americans who claim to do nothing more then to supply "aid" , ...
then also all the jordanians , the lebanese , the egyptians , the iranians , in short , anyone who support acts of terror , ...

last point , GLZ , every minute of the day , ...

have a nice day

[Arrian]

No, clearly, blowing up Israeli buses is unacceptable. You can't sink to the terrorists level and try to take the moral highground at the same time, Eli. Building a wall around the Pals and shutting them in is, IMO, a terrible thing to do.

Why not?
If every village and city is being checked(simultaneosly, not like in Defensive Wall) and all gunmen are killed in sight?

Err... how many soldiers do you have? How many villages and cities are there? Consider the fact, as you well know, that the civilian population (these would be the people you wouldn't shoot on sight) is against you and will actively aid those you are searching for. Consider the results when the US tried to root out the Viet Cong in Vietnam. We had all sorts of firepower and techonolgy... but the people were against us.

If you really believe that a full-blown IDF operation can wipe out Palestinian terrorism, you are, like I said, delusional. But I think your delusion is instructive, because it appears to match up pretty well with your PM's thought process.

-Arrian

[Disclaimer] By criticizing Israeli policy w/regard to the Palestinians, I do not condone terrorism vs. Israelis. The suicide bombers remain, in my mind, the most despicable (and detrimental to their own supposed cause) of all.[/disclaimer]

[Panag]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse


Just that if you got 3 Israelis in a room together they'd form 4 political parties...

More of an observation than a joke, I suppose.

hi ,

, sjee since when , ......

have a nice day

[Panag]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse

Why not? Blowing up Israeli buses is acceptable

No it isn't.

hi ,

but when we act to prevent such act's , a lot of people start to scream , including you , accusing us , of going to far , ...

have a nice day

[Panag]

Originally posted by Arrian


I think you're delusional. 99% of weapons and terrorists would be rooted out by the IDF? Comeon, surely you jest? You'll get some of them, maybe even most of them, but you're not gonna find 99%. Further, the sustained IDF action will help breed more terrorists. So then you pull back, build your wall, and they will still try to blow you up. Trying to stop any weapons going to the Pals would also be impossible. Building a giant wall around them? Shutting them off from the rest of the world? Do you actually think that is acceptable?

-Arrian

hi ,

at one point we had most of the weapons , .... out of their hands , BUT , under the pressure of some people we had to give them weapons , to police themselves , ....
and yes we can get 99.99 of the weapons , .....
if our actions breath more terrorists , that remains to be seen , at least there is some support of the pals , the civilians that is to remove all the weapons , ...

have a nice day

[KrazyHorse]

They hurt you, so anything you do is acceptable and we should shut our big mouths. I get it.

[Panag]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
They hurt you, so anything you do is acceptable and we should shut our big mouths. I get it.

hi ,

nope , that is not the case (!)
but some people should rethink their actions , instead of collecting "support" for the poor pals , .... and such stuff , ...

especially when they dont know the facts , ...

have a nice day

[KrazyHorse]

When have I collected "support" for the Pals? Do you think I'm out fundraising or something?

[Natan]

BTW, why is this being portrayed as an affront to Bush and the United States when the only word from the White House so far is "Israel has a right to defend itself, but don't go too far?"

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/middle_east/newsid_2054000/2054123.stm

"The president believes that Israel is in the middle of recovering from a very serious attack and that Israel has a right to defend itself," White House spokesman Ari Fleischer said.

At the same time, the president hoped that "whatever actions Israel takes will be cognizant of the fact that the path to peace must still be pursued, and Israel has to remember the consequences of its actions today for what happens tomorrow."

[KrazyHorse]

Because Bush is either going to have to disagree publically with Sharon (yet again) or backpedal. They've been sending out smoke signals for proposed Pal State lately. Looks like they're trying to delay right now...

[Adam Smith]

Anybody catch THIS item on MSNBC today about the Bush Administration's plan? Exerpt follows, my emphasis added.

Many in the administration remain doubtful that enough improvement can be made in the security situation within the next three months to secure the agreement of Prime Minister Ariel Sharon to the president’s plan and at least a partial pullback of Israeli military forces that provisional borders would require.

But Secretary of State Colin L. Powell has argued that, while the United States has an obligation to safeguard Israel’s security, nothing less than a time-specific “political horizon” would satisfy Arab leaders or give the Palestinian people enough hope to end their support of violence.

Bush’s speech, which had been scheduled for delivery today, was postponed in the wake of the latest Palestinian suicide bombing, a bus explosion that killed 19 Israelis yesterday in Jerusalem. Sources said that a new date has not been set but that plans are to deliver the speech between Thursday and Monday. Bush is scheduled to depart Tuesday for a two-day summit of the Group of Eight industrialized nations in Canada.

The president was told of the latest attack in a 5 a.m. telephone call yesterday from national security adviser Condoleezza Rice. “The general feeling was, you couldn’t walk out in the Rose Garden tomorrow and talk about ‘a peace proposal’ given what happened,” one source said.

Note that the most recent bus bombing both delayed the introduction of the plan, and reduced the probability of its being introduced at all. One wonders if this is what the more radical Pals intended.

edit: emphasis

[Panag]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
When have I collected "support" for the Pals? Do you think I'm out fundraising or something?

hi ,

hey , it say's "people" , ...... not certain person's , ...

have a nice day

status of today's attack ; 6 dead , 42 wounded , second device in anti-blast container

[KrazyHorse]

I'm just amazed at how easy it is to derail things. Is this simply an effect of playing to public sympathies day in and day out? i.e. do they simply have to choose a course and stick with it irrespective of daily events?

[Arrian]

One wonders if this is what the more radical Pals intended.

One has very little doubt.

-Arrian

[Adam Smith]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
I'm just amazed at how easy it is to derail things. Is this simply an effect of playing to public sympathies day in and day out?

I don't think its quite that, KH, or at least I hope not. There is a hell of a lot of diplomatic work that goes into setting one of these initiatives up. You are dealing with people who have entrenched positions and have hated each other for a long time. The last thing you want is a proposal that is dead on arrival. Not only is the diplomatic effort wasted, but the diplomat takes a credibility hit for the next time around.