Had an interesting conversation last night...

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov
I will use the analogy I have used before, "***." It's a terrible word to hear coming out of the mouths of someone who isn't gay. Why? Well, when a gay person says the word, I know where he's coming from. I realize right away it wasn't said out of hatred for homosexuals or to denegrate someone for being homosexual. Gays now use the word like blacks use "nigga," as a mark of pride in the face of past denegration.

But if I hear someone I know who isn't gay use the word, I know they aren't using it the same way a gay person is. The immediate reaction is going to be that the person is using it as a denegration of homosexuals. Since I can't know the intent of a straight person using it, I don't think they should use it if they don't want to offend gay people.

The same is true for "******." A black person knows where it is coming from when a black person says it. But history has shown when a white person says it, it's coming from a totally different place.

Will there be any issues that we do not agree on, Boris??

[orange]

fine then. If a non-white person ever says "cracker", even if talking about a lightly salted wafer, I will not only take offense, but complain to the proper authorities. However, I will call everyone I see "cracka" as a term of endearment.

[blackice]

Ok I am not a racist's and yes Orange the guy seem to be talking chit. A person is a person to me no matter what color or race or religon or sexual orientation or mind set until they prove to me they are not...

One question to Boris and Mr.Fun when a black person says "whitie" or when a white person says "white power" what is your impression then?

[Rogan Josh]

I once had a discussion with a black guy who claimed that it was not racist to make steriotypical remarks about white men because they are the originators of the 'dominant' western culture and still control the show. He claimed it was only racist to make anti-black comments because the blacks were oppressed.

I told him that I thought this was bollocks, and he got very upset about it. What do you think?

[The Viceroy]

Considering the term "******" comes from the latin word for black .. Niger .. how on earth can this relate to an individual, without offending the masses .It should not be used ..full stop.

As for African's being racist, you did right to point out his error .. all races, have racist individuals.. in my opinion, racists are simply insecure.

Calling a Pakistani a towel head simply shows utter ignorance, considering Sikhs wear turbans, and Arabs .. the vast majority of Pakistani's do not wear turbans.

My Indian friends find it so irritating that some people are so dense that they assume anybody who is S.Asian is Pakistani .. considering there are 1bn Indians, compared to only 250million Pakistani's .. Surely we should assume they are Indian first ?? Thats like saying all Caucasions are from England.

ignorance, insecurity and fear of change .. thats what racism is, and all peoples are vunrable to them.

[orange]

i think he was using 'towel heads' and 'sand ni**ers' as a term for all of the middle east, not just pakistanis.

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by orange
fine then. If a non-white person ever says "cracker", even if talking about a lightly salted wafer, I will not only take offense, but complain to the proper authorities. However, I will call everyone I see "cracka" as a term of endearment.

I have frequently referred to myself as Honkey McCracker, Mayor of Whitey Town.

"******" does not have any other alternative use other than the racial slur, so the cracker analogy is flawed. However, a black using cracker as a racist epithet is indeed wrong.

And if you want to call me cracka, I don't mind.
Whitey.

One question to Boris and Mr.Fun when a black person says "whitie" or when a white person says "white power" what is your impression then?

It's racism. A black person referring to a white person as "whitie" is just as unacceptable as a white person referring to a black person as "******." I will, however, once again refer to orange as whitey.

"White power" has always been used as a euphemism for white supremacy, so I can't say I find that term acceptable either. But I don't see black people going around saying "****** power." If they did, I can only imagine it would be a joke.

[Rogan Josh]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov
It's racism. A black person referring to a white person as "whitie" is just as unacceptable as a white person referring to a black person as "******." I will, however, once again refer to orange as whitey.

BAN HIM!!!!!

[Freeze]

How can you devote so much brainpower *cough* to semantics. The real issue never gets mentioned.

[orange]

i'm just saying that it's ridiculous that you can be offended by a word spoken by one person and accepting of it when spoken by another. It makes no sense at all.

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

Yes it does. To descend into legalese, it's the actus reus without the mens rea. Both are required to cause the offence.

[orange]

not at all, Bugs...

if I'm white and I go up to a black friend and say "hey my nigga" and the person gets offended, there is no mens rea, as I had no intent to cause harm nor did I intend a specific action to occur...in fact, there's no actus reus becuase I don't think the act of saying 'nigga' can be classified as a wrong, and if there is, than it would also apply if it were a black person saying it to another black person.

Edit: wait a minute...are you agreeing with me?

[Boris Godunov]

Orange:

A black person could not know your intent, and based upon past history, they would be perfectly justified in assuming your intention was malicious.

If called me a ******, I can guarantee you a similar reaction.

Didn't you read what I posted earlier?

[orange]

yes, I did, and I don't agree with an iota of it.

just because people I may or may not be distantly related to did harm to people he may or may not be distantly related to does not make me any more of a threat than a 'fellow black' who says the same thing.

Ideally, no one would use the word at all, and in fact, I don't think anyone should since it's so offensive, but i HATE the double standard that a black person can say it as a term of affection and a white person can't, even if they say it with the same meaning.

I don't think a gay person should call you '******' either...if you find it offensive for me to call you that, you should find it offensive for anyone to call you that...assuming the same tone and all...obviously there's a difference between "hey my nigga how are you?" and "STUPID NIG***"...

[morb]

Originally posted by Guynemer

May the universe bless you for your forgiveness, Orange, but I really think you're being too kind. I really don't think there is any reasonable situation where it is acceptable to call any black person a "jungle bunny" or "******" or "porch monkey". Likewise, there isn't an acceptable situation to call any Arab a "towelhead" or a "sand ******". If you don't think that using those terms are racist, but BET or AA are, well... I really don't know what to say to you.

is there ever a time when its appropriate to call a white person "cracker" or a jew an "ape or pig"?? seems to me that everyone is desensetised to "cracker" in the US and as according to recent footage on news media most arab kids are brought up believing jews are "apes and pigs."

why don't you get on their case and teach them not to be racist? just don't forget to breath in a little baggy, or you'll hyperventelate.