Had an interesting conversation last night...

[Guynemer]

Okay Orange; sorry for calling him your friend. And, sincerely, kudos to you for calling him on his bull****.

However, he can use all the platitudes in the world about how he's not a racist; the minute he starts throwing around "towelheads" and "sand ******s", he shows that he is a racist. If he had said, "Don't go to downtown D.C., the jungle bunnies will get you," would you be so forgiving in your assessment of him?

[Imran Siddiqui]

Jungle bunnies? That's one I haven't heard.

[Guynemer]

Originally posted by Sava
That's the whole point sweetheart. Listen Miss, I'm not going to put a judgement on some guy that some guy knows that some guys knows.... without actually meeting this person. I'm also not going to worry about how you or anyone else perceives my character. I know who I am, and I'm not going to cry over some little girl's interpretation of a few troll posts that I make.

My own damned fault. As I said months ago, when you made that "porch monkey" comment, you really aren't worth the effort. Glad to see you admit to trolling, though. Admitting you have a problem is the first step towards recovery.

[Guynemer]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Jungle bunnies? That's one I haven't heard.

Yes, well, Detroit's dirty little secret--one of the most racist areas in the country, and statistically the most segregated. In my young life, I think I've heard every existing derogatory term for blacks.

[Sava]

Look Boris, I'm not going to start crying if that's what you're looking for. And I truly am sorry, but if someone online making a crack about AiDS is going to get you this upset, I feel sorry for you. I can't even imagine how you'd react if something truly bad happened to you.

Think for a moment from my point of view. I didn't know your life history nor the life history of other Poly posters. I'm a 21 year old American college student. I recognize my ignorance and the ignorance of others. If you want to have a pity party, fine. If you want to hold some grudge against me, or ignore my posts fine. But seriously, get on with your life. Stop pining over a few words that some a**hole online wrote.

[chequita guevara]

Didn't ya ever see Do the Right Thing, Imran? One of the characters goes through all the derrogatory names for Black folks.

[orange]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
No, Orange, I see that you called him on it, as you should have. But you want to make an exception for ignorance.

Oh, I'm making no exceptions for him. Trust me. But it is the first I've heard of someone actually throwing around these terms in person.

Racism is largely a result of ignornace. It is one of the pillarsof racism. I'm glad you called the guy on it, and tried to make him think about it. But what he said was racist, and those were obviously the feelings he had. Maybe he hadn't thought things through clearly, maybe he backpedled when he realized he was with a group of people that wouldn't tollerate the ****. I can't say. But it was still racist.

I agree. What he said was racist. I was simply clarifying that I don't think he is a habitual racist/white supremacist. I think it was just an ill-timed poorly constructed ignorant thing to say. I mean what he was trying to get across - "New York is a dangerous place to make a living as it is a major target for terrorists" - was a valid point, but the way he worded it so stunned me and everyone else in the room...it was just a shame.

However, he can use all the platitudes in the world about how he's not a racist; the minute he starts throwing around "towelheads" and "sand ******s", he shows that he is a racist.

I also think he didn't realize how severe those terms are taken by the groups they are meant to offend. It seems to me that his family uses these terms quite liberally to refer to people of those races...he may not realize that outside his realm, those terms are NOT taken lightly.

If he had said, "Don't go to downtown D.C., the jungle bunnies will get you," would you be so forgiving in your assessment of him?

If his point was - "Washington is a dangerous place to be at night" - and not - "Black people are nothing more than criminals" - I would have reacted in the same way that I reacted to the statements he made about middle eastern terrorists. Sometimes you can just tell from the sitaution what one means by what one says.

Imran - you've never heard that term before?

[Sava]

Originally posted by Guynemer



My own damned fault. As I said months ago, when you made that "porch monkey" comment, you really aren't worth the effort. Glad to see you admit to trolling, though. Admitting you have a problem is the first step towards recovery.

Of course I admit it. I bask in the glory in it. I even think its funny sometimes when people take me seriously. Perhaps its my own fault for assuming others have as thick a skin that I do. I'm not at all surprise that you are quoting the whole porch monkey thing. I'm sure you have it framed on your wall above your computer, and you show it to all your friends constantly saying, "Can you believe some people?!"

Listen Guy, if you want to get into a discussion about my own values and stuff, you can chat with me. I'm really a nice guy. But I also speak my mind and don't give a sh*t about what anyone says or thinks. I'm not a racist. I believe everyone deserves an equal chance in life, but there are people out there who fit into some of the stereotypes; and you know what, when I see an example of it, I'm going to point it out. Does that mean I am racist? No. I just call it like I see it.

[orange]

Guy, Boris, Sava, et. al. - I don't know the story behind what you're talking about...but can you please take it off the boards? Thanks

[Imran Siddiqui]

Didn't ya ever see Do the Right Thing, Imran? One of the characters goes through all the derrogatory names for Black folks.

Nope... haven't seen many movies I should though.

[Sava]

Sorry Orange, didn't mean to threadjack.

Just for the record, what your friend said is racist, but I cannot say if HE is racist.

[Guynemer]

Originally posted by orange

I also think he didn't realize how severe those terms are taken by the groups they are meant to offend. It seems to me that his family uses these terms quite liberally to refer to people of those races...he may not realize that outside his realm, those terms are NOT taken lightly.

Jumping Jesus on a pogo stick, Orange, the word "******" is right there. How could he NOT know, seriously?

If his point was - "Washington is a dangerous place to be at night" - and not - "Black people are nothing more than criminals" - I would have reacted in the same way that I reacted to the statements he made about middle eastern terrorists. Sometimes you can just tell from the sitaution what one means by what one says.

May the universe bless you for your forgiveness, Orange, but I really think you're being too kind. I really don't think there is any reasonable situation where it is acceptable to call any black person a "jungle bunny" or "******" or "porch monkey". Likewise, there isn't an acceptable situation to call any Arab a "towelhead" or a "sand ******". If you don't think that using those terms are racist, but BET or AA are, well... I really don't know what to say to you.

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by Sava
Look Boris, I'm not going to start crying if that's what you're looking for.

No, just some sincerety, not followed by wisecracks and "I can't believe people are mad about this!" comments (see below)

And I truly am sorry, but if someone online making a crack about AiDS is going to get you this upset, I feel sorry for you.

I rest my case.

I can't even imagine how you'd react if something truly bad happened to you.

Oh, like, watching someone I care about in the hospital dying of AIDS? I think I handled it pretty well.

Think for a moment from my point of view.

Works both ways, doesn't it? Try it for yourself.

I'm not having a pity party, I think I'm showing perhaps a valuable thing for the future. If you're going to say stupid things, be prepared for some consequences. And don't dismiss the ire of those you upset with such comments, take it seriously, and drop the smug caveats.

I am not as upset over this as you seem to think (it hasn't crossed my mind when I've not been on Apolyton). You're dismissal of other people's anger reflects more on you than them. I hope (and this is my last comment on the matter), in the future, you will have a little more concern for people's feelings, for your sake.

[Inverse Icarus]

in my opinion, there are generic sterotypes for each nationality / religion / ethnicity. in the modern world it's not so much what these sterotypes are, it's more of just looking for an insult for a specific group of people.

IMHO, there are good and bad people of every race color and creed. there are great black people and there are dirty ni**ers, there are great polish people and there are goddamned polacks (i'm polish/irish/german if you care), and there are great muslim/arabic people (i have an arabic friend) and there are those dirty towel heads that blew up the WTC.

[orange]

Sava - no problem

i suppose I just think it's better to destroy ignorance than to simply ignore it.

And like I said, BET and AA aren't racist in the sense that they don't feel that one group is supreme...they're racist in the fact that they knowingly or unknowingly help to segregate society...and this I don't like