Race differences

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by reds4ever
i'd always understood 'race' to a sub class of 'species'

This is correct. A race is is a biologically distinct group within a species that does not interbreed with other members of its species. IIRC, they can breed, they just don't.

[reds4ever]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara


Speciation refers to groups of animals dividing into different "species." That's not at issue here. We're talking about whether phenotypes = biological races, which they do not.

Currently, there is only one human race.

how many species of dog are there, how many races of dog?



i'm not being awkward, but i'd like to know where the boundary lies, and does it lie in a different place for humans?

[BeBMan]

Originally posted by Ramo
Try this (you'll note that it's from the HGP people themselves).

http://www.ornl.gov/hgmis/elsi/minorities.html

Unfortunaely, I can´t access this site, do you have another link? I really would like to read it

[DinoDoc]

For you.

Originally posted by BeBro
Unfortunaely, I can´t access this site, do you have another link? I really would like to read it

Minorities, Race, and Genomics

The U.S. Department of Energy's (DOE) Human Genome Program devotes 3% to 5% of its annual Human Genome Project (HGP) budget toward studying the ethical, legal, and social issues (ELSI) surrounding availability of genetic information. Some of these projects study potential affects of ELSI, others seek to educate professionals through literature, conferences, workshops, and multimedia. Among the programs funded by DOE ELSI are educational materials for physicians, educators, students, clergy, and judges and other legal professionals.

One of these programs is a partnership with the National Educational Foundation of Zeta Phi Beta Sorority, Inc. The sorority has planned and conducted three major informational conferences on the Human Genome Project and its impact on minority communities. The conferences covered a variety of topics--from basic genetics and HGP history to gene testing and careers in genetics. Held in Atlanta in 2001, Philadelphia in 2000, and New Orleans in 1999, these conferences have sparked numerous follow-up meetings and training sessions led by members of the educational foundation. [Proceedings from the 2000 conference are available online.]

In 1996, DOE HGP partnered with Tuskegee University to present the 3-day conference, Plain Talk About the Human Genome Project. The conference brought together internationally recognized scientists, bioethicists, and legal scholars from government, industry, and academia to discuss the ethical, legal, and social implications (ELSI) of the use and misuse of genetic information. In rare "both-sides-of-the-argument" discussions, speakers expressed apprehension about the project and the use of its resulting genetic information. Concerns ranged from the fear of actuarial classifications of "genetic exceptionalism" to the burden African Americans would face if they were among those labeled by some as a biological underclass. Focused particularly on how the data might affect African Americans, the meeting was also a vehicle for students from Tuskegee and other historically black institutions to meet with genome scientists, hear the issues, and explore career possibilities in genomics. Proceedings from this conference are available as a book, Plain Talk About the Human Genome Project, 292 pp., 1997.

About 150 leaders of minority communities came together in June 1997, at the University of Maryland, Baltimore (UMB) to learn about the Human Genome Project. The DOE HGP-sponsored meeting's goals were to (1) inform minority communities about the Human Genome Project by explaining its potential benefits and clarifying its possible ethical, legal, and social implications (ELSI); and (2) make the aspirations and interests of these communities known to genome project scientists and policymakers. This program grew from organizers' concerns about an information vacuum among minorities regarding the genome project and the possibility that suspicions will arise about the project's intent. Proceedings from this conference have been combined with an essay that was not part of the conference to form the book, The Human Genome Project and Minority Communities: Ethical, Social, and Political Dilemmas, edited by Raymond Zilinskas (Monterey Institute of International Studies) and Peter Balint (University of Maryland). It addresses the divisions between minority groups and the scientific community, particularly in the area of medical and genetic research. 144 pp., 2000. [Available through bookstores, including online suppliers.]

[BeBMan]

Thanks

[Ramo]

Actually, I was referring to the articles that HGP group referenced. Do you want links?

[BeBMan]

Originally posted by Ramo
Actually, I was referring to the articles that HGP group referenced. Do you want links?

Yup, would be nice

[Peacemaker]

Why is this theory so hard to understand? You need to stop looking at this as just a balck and white issue. As groups af animals breed they devolop their own traits. Be it size, strength, intelligence or any other trait.


If we look at this issue with dogs insteed of humans and look at the difference at breeds(race) most would say certian breeds of dogs are smarter than others. If this is true for dogs then why can't it be true for humans.


Let the feast begin.

[Ramo]

The titles sound relevant on these:

http://www.theatlantic.com/issues/2001/04/olson-p1.htm

http://news.bmn.com/hmsbeagle/97/notes/profile

http://news.bmn.com/hmsbeagle/27/people/pressbox.htm

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/first/race.html

http://www.nap.edu/books/0309059313/html/index.html

http://www.aaanet.org/stmts/racepp.htm

http://www.africana.com/DailyArticles/index_20010129.htm

[BeBMan]

If birds can fly why not humans

Originally posted by Peacemaker
Why is this theory so hard to understand? You need to stop looking at this as just a balck and white issue. As groups af animals breed they devolop their own traits. Be it size, strength, intelligence or any other trait.


If we look at this issue with dogs insteed of humans and look at the difference at breeds(race) most would say certian breeds of dogs are smarter than others. If this is true for dogs then why can't it be true for humans.


Let the feast begin.

Or better not

[BeBMan]

Oh thanks for the links, Ramo

Seems I´ve enough to read now.

[reds4ever]

are you replying to me ramo? if so i would like your last post to be linked to the post of mine (to avoid confusion) you were replying to, then, a secondary link to whichever piece of information that you took out of context.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Ramo
Actually, I was referring to the articles that HGP group referenced.

Then you should have said so!

[reds4ever]

Peacemaker

that's it in a nutshell!

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by reds4ever
how many species of dog are there, how many races of dog?

The term race doesn't really apply to dogs, since as anyone with dogs has learned, they'll happily bread with each other. Their may be some size limitations between say, Great Danes and Yorkies, but they recognize each other as dogs, and will try and breed. As I understand it, there is only one species of dog, if you exclude wild African dogs, which aren't really dogs. Dingos might constitute a seperate species of dog, but I don't know.

Closely related species can interbreed, also, like Lions and Tigers (though it requires intentional effort on out part, since they won't do it themselves) and horses and donkeys, and dogs and wolves. The distinction, as I understand it is, different races of an animal won't interbreed, but they are members of the same species.

i'm not being awkward, but i'd like to know where the boundary lies, and does it lie in a different place for humans?

No, it lies in the same place for humans. We will more or less happily breed with other members of our own kind, except sometimes for ideological reasons.