When movies get facts wrong. . .

[Drekkus]

Originally posted by Dissident
and Europeans don't have similar unreasonable stereotypes of americans?

not all of us are gun-toting bible thumpers (although I do own a gun ). I don't own a bible though

yet I hear this constantly from Europeans. So I really don't think it is reasonable to accuse americans of being the only people that stereotype people from around the world.

and not all of us ride around in big suv's either. many people enjoy driving small cars.

that is all.

I saw a movie called 'The Bible and Gun club', a black and white movie about sweaty traveling salesmen who sold bibles to the lady of the house, and guns to the man of the house, to 'protect his family'.

It was somewhat, stereotyping.

[bondetamp]

The problem isn't so much the facts as the general "feel" of the movie. Or, rather, the general feel of a lot of popular movies (or any popular media. My image of the old Gaulls are from Asterix. ) over an extended period.

How is the general public's feel about the Vietnam War? Could the movie industry possibly have something to do with that? How about the old west? The 1920's?

If people are so smart that popular culture doesn't influence them, then why are vikings depicted with horned helmets?

[ZoboZeWarrior]

Originally posted by Drekkus
Starship Troopers was fantastic! It's a movie that shows the dangers of fascism. All the steel jaws and blue eyes, the gung ho retoric, the nazi like outfits, and still you feel for them in their fight against evil. It doesn't show you right and wrong, it leaves you without a clear conclusion. It's very over the top, but doesn't ridicule. That's why the general audience didn't like it.

100% agree. The film is inspired from a book of a writer exposing an Fascist utopia. But slighty ironical.

The main point of the film, isn't not only the action, but the message : beware to propaganda !

This film don't have so much success in USA. Why ?

[Drekkus]

Bondetamp,

Vikings didn't wear horns?

Well, shows my point that over time, people will slowly confuse fiction for fact, when represented in a factual manner.

Zobo,

Like I said, audiences are used to clear pictures about what's right and what's wrong. When a picture leaves that in the middle, people get confused and discontent.

Don't know if Starship Troopers did any worse in the USA than outside it? Is that a fact?

[Sprayber]

U571

Didn't anyone read the text after the film? It mentioned that it was the Brits that captured the first decoding machine and that the events depicted in the movie was based on an incident later on in the war.


Some of you look to Hollywood films to comfrim your well entrenched bias against the US. You take the films seriously when Americans watch them for entertainment. The question becomes, if these movies are so terrible why are you watching them. And if you don't watch them how can you sit and say they are inaccurate. Is it that you take someone elses' word for it? And no one is forcing you to watch them. Doesn't your country have any movies that you can be watching instead of the evil propaganda that comes from the seedy smoke filled rooms of Hollywood?

It has been said already. If you watched U571 for an in depth understanding of submarine warefare or for an accurate depiction of history, then will be disappointed. I mean come on, a cook that can also be used to navigate the sub?

BTW: when an American says that we saved your Ass in WWII they are usually looking to get a response out of you or they aren't very up to date on history. Either way, you are being very naive to take the bait.

[bondetamp]

Originally posted by JohnT
Of course those here who claim that movies can't get historical facts right will swear up and down that American Beauty is a true rendering of middle-class America.

Hint: it ain't.

Of course it isn't.

Happiness is.

[Guynemer]

Originally posted by The Third Man
Further, the Patriot is NOT trying to sell a message of political conquest like Triumph of the Will. The Patriot is made WELL after the fact. Blame it for historical innaccuracy all you like, you CAN'T claim its pushing a modern day United States genocide.

Fair enough. Can I still blame it for being a massive, steaming pile of elephant dung?

[Lung]

Originally posted by Drekkus
Starship Troopers was fantastic! It's a movie that shows the dangers of fascism. All the steel jaws and blue eyes, the gung ho retoric, the nazi like outfits, and still you feel for them in their fight against evil. It doesn't show you right and wrong, it leaves you without a clear conclusion. It's very over the top, but doesn't ridicule. That's why the general audience didn't like it.

Yes, and this is another bone of contention i have with this movie! It's message was so damned obvious i felt it was being rammed down my throat. It was Robocop in space It seemed like a message to dimwitted teenagers, which i suppose it was It also seemed more like an unfunny spoof than a subtle message on the dangers of fanaticism.

Interestly though, i never noticed until i grew up the nazi-esque uniforms of Darth Vader's troops, although i think the point there was simply to insinuate that they were the bad guys.

[rah]

I thought SST was pretty funny.
Yes very blatant on the theme, but so was the book and it was written for juveniles so we have to cut some slack there.
The new flashes were hilarious.
Nice TaTas.

But I too was very disappointed with those very unfuturistic weapons. It was hard enough to sustain belief even without that.

RAH

[Dr Strangelove]

Originally posted by Lung


Yes, and this is another bone of contention i have with this movie! It's message was so damned obvious i felt it was being rammed down my throat. It was Robocop in space It seemed like a message to dimwitted teenagers, which i suppose it was It also seemed more like an unfunny spoof than a subtle message on the dangers of fanaticism.

Interestly though, i never noticed until i grew up the nazi-esque uniforms of Darth Vader's troops, although i think the point there was simply to insinuate that they were the bad guys.

Odd, I had thought that Heinlein was rather serious about some of his fascist ideas, he repeated them so often. In some ways the movie does seem to parody his ideas, but then he had no input into how it was made. ( He's dead isn't he? )

I once saw somebody compare the end scene of the first movie, when Luke and Hans get their medals, to "Triumph of the Will", supposedly because in the scene the ranks are formed up in neat columns facing a stark podium with tall lines towering upwards.

[Tingkai]

Re: I'm annoyed.

Originally posted by Alynzia
I'm always annoyed when movies gloss over a character being homosexual or bisexual just to make a story to please the majority.

The guy in 'A Beautiful Mind' was gay.

I just saw A Beautiful Mind and thought it was a great movie, but I was shocked when I found out how much it distorted the life of John Nash.

The movie shows Nash getting married, having a kid, and the wife sticks by his side through the rough times and is there in the end when he gets the Nobel prize.

But one site, http://www-groups.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/~...ans/Nash.html, I found had the following:

"During his time at MIT Nash began to have personal problems with his life which were in addition to the social difficulties he had always suffered. He met Eleanor Stier and they had a son, John David Stier, who was born on 19 June 1953. Nash did not want to marry Eleanor although she tried hard to persuade him. In the summer of 1954, while working for RAND, Nash was arrested in a police operation to trap homosexuals. He was dismissed from RAND.

One of Nash's students at MIT, Alicia Larde, became friendly with him and by the summer of 1955 they were seeing each other regularly. In 1956 Nash's parents found out about his continuing affair with Eleanor and about his son John David Stier. The shock may have contributed to the death of Nash's father soon after but even if it did not Nash may have blamed himself. In February of 1957 Nash married Alicia; by the autumn of 1958 she was pregnant but, a couple of months later near the end of 1958, Nash's mental state became very disturbed.

Norbert Wiener was one of the first to recognize that Nash's extreme eccentricities and personality problems were actually symptoms of a medical disorder. A long sad episode followed which included periods of hospital treatment, temporary recovery, then further treatment. Alicia eventually divorced Nash, although she continued to try to help him, and after a period of extreme mental torture he appeared to become lost to the world, removed from ordinary society, although he spent much of his time in the Mathematics Department at Princeton."

So the guy had two sons by two women, not one as portrayed in the movie.

Apparently, he does remarry Alicia., according to this article

http://www.dailyprincetonian.com/Content/2002/01/11/news/1467.shtml

Now I know this is a movie and I don't expect it to be completely accurate, but you got to wonder how his second son feels about it.

[Faboba]

Two sons... two women... AND gay.

How did he manage that?

In what way was he gay? Are we talking actually here or did someone tell you that he was and you believed it?

[Tingkai]

Originally posted by Faboba
Two sons... two women... AND gay.

How did he manage that?

In what way was he gay? Are we talking actually here or did someone tell you that he was and you believed it?

Maybe the guy was just really horny.

The first article mentions that he was caught in a police raid on homosexuals and that's why he was fired from RAND.

It seems to be true. The BBC has a story about the debate about artistry over the facts.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/in_depth/entertainment/2002/oscars_2002/newsid_1809000/1809454.stm

"The New York Times critic who praised certain aspects of A Beautiful Mind also found that the story was "almost entirely counterfeit." "

[Gibsie]

I noticed a very stupid mistake in the movie "Evolution" last night... David Duchovny's character noted that the alien DNA was special because it had "ten base pairs", as opposed to us Earthlings with "four base pairs". It's clear what they meant to say, but in actually his scientist character just said that humans have a smaller genome than the smallest of viruses!

[DaShi]

"Elvis played a helicopter pilot once. He made so many mistakes. We were just laughing at him."