A breach of the Geneva Convention?

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

Before anyone gets excitable, this is not a US-bashing thread so don't treat it like one.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/americas/newsid_1754000/1754444.stm

The above link highlights concerns over potential breaches of the Geneva Convention in the handling of Al-Quadr prisoners. The report I've just seen on BBC TV news is more extreme- it gives a report on the prisoners being kept in cages exposed to the elements.

If this is true, I can't see it as anything other than a major mistake. If the allies are going to be the good guys, we've got to walk it like we talk it.

[faded glory]

Rumsfeld: The are not Prisoners of war. They are Unlawful detainee's.


was watching breifing during lunch. Stufflebeam said, "These Detainee's are so fanatical they would Chew through the hydrolic's just to bring the plane down"

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

Human rights groups have already expressed concern about treatment of the prisoners. Amnesty International says it has heard reports the men were chained to their seats, hooded and sedated during the 8,000-mile flight.



They will be handled not as prisoners of war, because they're not, but as unlawful combatants

Donald Rumsfeld

"All those in US custody following the military operations in Afghanistan must be treated humanely, with full respect for international standards," an Amnesty statement said.

And the International Red Cross (ICRC) said it regards the men - thought to number about 20 out of more than 350 in US custody - as prisoners of war who therefore have all the rights and privileges of POWs under the Geneva Convention.

It is reported that the prisoners had their beards shaved, for reasons of hygiene, prior to the 27-hour journey, a measure the ICRC says might constitute a breach of their human dignity under the convention.

Humanitarian observers

US Secretary of Defence Donald Rumsfeld declared the detainees were "unlawful combatants" and have no rights under the Geneva Convention.

"They will be handled not as prisoners of war, because they're not, but as unlawful combatants," he said.



Razor wire and shark infested seas ring the base


But Jamie Fellner of Human Rights Watch said that every captured fighter is entitled under the Geneva Convention and international law to humane conditions of confinement.

The ICRC says it plans to start visiting the prisoners at Guantanamo Bay early next week to ensure they are being treated humanely.

The report I saw also detailed prisoners being chained and sedated on the flights, which I can grudgingly accept, and being kept in exposed cages, which I can't.

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

Unlawful detainees? Quite possibly, but who's breaking the laws?

[Dis]

hmm well it is pushing the line I guess. I'd have to see the specifics of POW treatments. I only know the general stuff. But the safety of U.S. troops and the plane has to be taken into consideration. That's a highly dangerous thing transporting prisoners by aircraft. Watch the movie con air. yes I know it is a cheesy action flick. But it gives an indication of the dangers involved.

and you don't think the terrorists would bring the plane down? I would say they would under any circumstance they could. One already committed suicide. Death is better than being in U.S. custody.

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

Like I said, I don't object to them being chained and sedated on the flights- I'm operating under no illusions. However, if the TV footage is reliable, I wouldn't keep livestock in that "prison".

[DinoDoc]

From what I've been able to understand from watching Roland's and MtG's conversation the whole issue revolves around weather or not the prisoners can be considered mercenaries.

[Immortal Wombat]

are they being paid?

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Immortal Wombat
are they being paid?

Allow me to quote our esteamed moderator:

As far as al Qaeda members being classified as Mercs goes, it seems a bit strange to hinge it on compensation - they certainly are paid fighters, so would there be an issue hinging on whether they were smart enough to get paid well? And half the thing about being a merc is the sheer fun of it, not the pay.

You can find the rest of the arguement here: http://apolyton.net/forums/showthrea...0&pagenumber=5

[Dis]

some of them are Taliban soldiers aren't they? Surely they aren't mecs. But I suppose it is reasonable to classify Al Quida troops as mercs.

[Dr. Nick]

What makes the difference between a merc or a soldier under the Geneva Convention? Mercs could be considered volunteers, so even still they are owed the rights of the Geneva Convention, correct?

[General Ludd]

Regardless of their military status, they are human beings. This is not about wether they are mercenaries, soldiers, or potatoe farmers - it's about inhumane conditions.

[HisMajestyBOB]

One of the commanders in charge of the base said something to the effect that "It won't be comfortable, but it will be humane."

As long as they get food, water and medical care, they'll be fine.

[Dis]

you forgot shelter

[Faeelin]

I wouldn't call Al-Queda members human.

Mind you, I wouldn't have called the SS human, either.