Personal ID's, how is it in your country?

[Az]

'To be anonymous, to go privately, to move residence without telling the authorities is a fundamental liberty which is about to be taken from us. People may not choose to exercise this entitlement to privacy, or see the point of it, but once it's gone and a vast database is built, eventually to be accessed by every tentacle of the government machine, we will never be able to claw it back. We are about to surrender a right which is precious, rare even in western democracies, and profoundly emblematic of our culture and civilisation.'

What's the connection between that and IDs?

[Spiffor]

BTW, I was wrong. Over here, ID cards are not compulsory. However, identity checks can be performed as a "preventive measure" (if the policeman thinks you're about to commit something illegal, for example ), and if you neither have IDs, driver's licence, or family registry with you, the judicial procedure to control your identity will commence.

Of course, brown people are always suspected of being illegal immigrants, so they get checked all the time

[MikeH]

Exactly!

[Spiffor]

MikeH:
Can your policemen control the identity of the citizens as a "preventive measure", or must they be inquiring on an actual crime to begin these checks?

What happens if you are suspected in a crime (thus legitimately prompting identity checks on you), but have none of the voluntary IDs?

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

Originally posted by Agathon
Anything proposed by that scum-sucking bastard Blair should be abandoned and he should be shot.

Such as the minimum wage, increased spending on health and education, increased child benefit and the family tax credit?

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

Originally posted by Spiffor

Can your policemen control the identity of the citizens as a "preventive measure", or must they be inquiring on an actual crime to begin these checks?

What happens if you are suspected in a crime (thus legitimately prompting identity checks on you), but have none of the voluntary IDs?

Police can only request identification if they have reasonable suspicion that an offence has ben committed (or is likely to be committed). Such as being black in a residential area, for example.

Not having ID is not a crime. You can be arrested if a policeman suspects you of providing false ID, but making charges stick would be tricky.

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Lazarus and the Gimp
Police can only request identification if they have reasonable suspicion that an offence has ben committed (or is likely to be committed). Such as being black in a residential area, for example.

So far, that's identical to France.

Not having ID is not a crime. You can be arrested if a policeman suspects you of providing false ID, but making charges stick would be tricky.

I don't know if it is a crime here either (I haven't seen any legal punishment for that), but once they ask for your identity, the police will keep you until they get it - the legal procedure is about retrieving your identity, but I don't know if you're supposed to be punished after that.

Fortunately, should you find the right policemen, your stay at the police station can be fantastically unpleasant

[Az]

Of course, brown people are always suspected of being illegal immigrants, so they get checked all the time

You see, if you had IDs mandatory, brown people would get hassled much less. Just show an ID, and be on your way.

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Azazel
You see, if you had IDs mandatory, brown people would get hassled much less. Just show an ID, and be on your way.

For all intent and purposes, IDs are mandatory in fact in France, even if they're not in law. I haven't met anybody who hasn't one. It's indeed not much of a hassle if a control happens once every blue moon. It becomes a constant humiliation when you are specifically singled out because of your skin, and are prompted to show your ID every day or so.

Besides, if you don't have your papers at hand (forgot to take the wallet, or have the habit of never taking the wallet without a good reason for it), the hassle increases considerably. Again, it's not that much of a problem when you're rarely controlled. But the occurence becomes very unpleasant when such controls are frequent

[Az]

Besides, if you don't have your papers at hand (forgot to take the wallet, or have the habit of never taking the wallet without a good reason for it), the hassle increases considerably. Again, it's not that much of a problem when you're rarely controlled. But the occurence becomes very unpleasant when such controls are frequent

But they aren't really. I get my license checked by police maybe twice a year, for example. (And I wasn't doing anything wrong, of course)

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Azazel
But they aren't really. I get my license checked by police maybe twice a year, for example. (And I wasn't doing anything wrong, of course)

You're white, silly.

[Sandman]

I'm less concerned about the freedom aspect than the economic aspects of the UK ID card scheme. Put simply, it's an extravagant, obnoxious piece of bureaucratic busy-work that will have absolutely no effect whatsoever on immigration, crime or anything else.

It's heart-breaking for people like myself, who think that the government can work to improve peoples lives, to see money being squandered in such a way. It would be better if the government built three more Millennium Domes than go ahead with this.

[Az]

You're white, silly.

Israeli police are hardly Arian posterboys ( these are undercover)

Betcha you wouldn't know which one is the palestinian and which one is the border patrol guard, without the uniform.
Israeli police on a visit in the US:



So no, it doesn't have anything to do with my ethnicity, since they say jack**** in this country.

[DanS]

It is interesting that Anglophone countries (minus HK) seem to have similar laws and views on this.

Just to be clear, I think you can refuse to give your ID to a policeman, if you wish. They might then arrest you and bring you down to the police station for identification by other means, but I don't think you can be arrested specifically for refusing to show your ID.

On the other hand, you can be arrested and charged for refusing to identify yourself by name.

[child of Thor]

That very last picture kinda crystalizes one of the main flaws behind compulsary ID.

Its another of the 'them' + 'us' tools used by governments to build the barriers used to control our lives for their own (often) murky ends