The Second Coming of Apple

[Tassadar500]

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Right, Tassadar?

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OMG THIS THREAD IS TEH JEWISH CONSPIRACY!!!1111!!111onemilliononehundredthousand eleven!!1

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[Agathon]

Since when did Montreal become this super-fun city?

(1) Since you can smoke pretty much where the **** you like (at least compared to TO). (2) Since the Quebecers aren't a bunch of do gooder prudes, and Saturday night downtown is great with all the food and my usual half tanker of beer.

There's a lot to be thankful for with regard to Quebec. Beautiful women for one, liberal attitudes for another, and permanently annoying those Albertan *******s tops all.

[Drake Tungsten]

Funny, McGill is older, but U of T is better.

I must also call shenanigans on this. I don't really care, but I've been told to believe that McGill is better than U of T...

[Agathon]

It used to be better than it is now. UofT is the 800lb gorilla of Canadian Universities. It's consistently the top Canadian Research University and has been so for years. It attracts the lion's share of funding and has the most Canada Research chairs. Plus it's big.

Moreover UBC is probably better than McGill now. McGill no longer has a Classics department. What university can be considered among the elite educational institution without a Classics department?

The idea of McGill probably has some snob appeal, but it's not the university it used to be.

[Asher]

If you're using research money as some kind of metric, I'm sure you're quite aware of the massive increases the UofC is getting in research funding from the government and private companies lately...

It's up 43% this year alone.

[Agathon]

Sure, but it has a long way to go to get anywhere near UofT. In fact Calgary slipped 6.9% in funding this year and slipped one place to ninth, below Ottawa according to one source. UofA gets more.

Size matters. That is why we shouldn't forget the Université de Montréal.

[Agathon]

Check out researchinfosource they do the usual list.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Agathon
Check out researchinfosource they do the usual list.

How do they get their numbers? They show the UofC as getting $165M, while the official numbers in the budget show $247M. Specifically:

Federal Tri-Council (CIHR, NSERC and SSHRC): $60,385,272
Other federal government programs: $36,246,912
Government of Alberta: $74,608,238
Corporate: $39,000,513
Other (NGOs, foundations, donors, etc.): $25,983,789
Investment: $10,531,721
TOTAL: 	$246,756,445

In any case, the funding in 1994 was 10M, and now it's at 247M 10 years later.

It's a clear trend.

[Agathon]

Perhaps they are wrong. I think the report might not include this year's money. If Calgary has been going up, then that's good news, because they were slipping from 2000 onwards.

In sheer amount it's hard to beat U of T, but we have a lot more faculty (although the university is dragged down by the satellite campuses, which are primarily teaching universities rather than research institutions, although they all count as part of U of T).

[Asher]

The research investment went down a bit after 2000 because the Alberta government earmarked the ~70M/year to University expansion and improvement, rather than research. They built a bunch of new buildings and hired a bunch more staff, which is why the number is going way up now. All the new buildings they built (the first of which was the ICT -- Information and Communications Technology building...compsci) are open with full staff, and they're getting research money.

[Agathon]

They're all climbing. The Canada Research Chairs program and other increased government monies certainly made life around U of T a lot better.

I find some of the things RIS says funny. Their lauding of ****holes like McMaster & Guelph is rather amusing. Then again MacLeans is inclined to do that sort of thing.

An encouraging sign is UofA's performance.

[Agathon]

The research investment went down a bit after 2000 because the Alberta government earmarked the ~70M/year to University expansion and improvement, rather than research. They built a bunch of new buildings and hired a bunch more staff, which is why the number is going way up now. All the new buildings they built (the first of which was the ICT -- Information and Communications Technology building...compsci) are open with full staff, and they're getting research money.

I take it you've seen U of T, aka the building site.

Why are infotech buildings always so hideous? The new Baden building at U of T is a monstrosity, as is the new IT centre out at the UTM campus. I have to teach in the latter - it's like a morgue.

[Agathon]

How do they get their numbers? They show the UofC as getting $165M, while the official numbers in the budget show $247M.

If you'd done the math, you would have the answer. $165m must be the 2003 figure. $247m represents about a 49% increase. Give or take a few million here or there, that accounts for what you said. I'm guessing that the report takes last year's figures as it would be hard to publish yearly figures for 2004 before the year is out.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Agathon
If you'd done the math, you would have the answer. $165m must be the 2003 figure. $247m represents about a 49% increase. Give or take a few million here or there, that accounts for what you said. I'm guessing that the report takes last year's figures as it would be hard to publish yearly figures for 2004 before the year is out.

I had considered that, but even then the number is wrong.

Last year was $173M.

These seem to be magic numbers they have...