Self defense of the home(UK)

[:) Smiley]

Is it the kind of warning shot to anyone else thinking of breaking in?

[Whoha]

Re: Re: Re: Self defense of the home(UK)

Originally posted by DinoDoc
You fire warning shots?

it is a hypothetical if, I should have been more clear about that.

[David Floyd]

Or it results in trigger happy folk who shoot anything - including burglars who surrender when looking at a full loaded gun pointing at them.

So what? He shouldn't be in your house to begin with. If you simply wait for the cops, he'll sit in prison for six months, tops, and then rob someone else.

On the other hand, if you ****ing shoot his ass, he won't rob anyone again, ever. So **** the mother****er. If he's ****ing stupid enough to be a criminal, he deserves to get his ass shot off.

[Pekka]

On the other hand, if you ****ing shoot his ass, he won't rob anyone again, ever. So **** the mother****er. If he's ****ing stupid enough to be a criminal, he deserves to get his ass shot off.

This is great. Can you do few more of these that I can use in my fictional story?

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by David Floyd
On the other hand, if you ****ing shoot his ass, he won't rob anyone again, ever. So **** the mother****er. If he's ****ing stupid enough to be a criminal, he deserves to get his ass shot off.

You missed the point.

The point is any burglar entering a house is going to shoot anybody inside the house on sight under such a hypothetical scenario.

[asleepathewheel]

Originally posted by David Floyd


So what? He shouldn't be in your house to begin with. If you simply wait for the cops, he'll sit in prison for six months, tops, and then rob someone else.

On the other hand, if you ****ing shoot his ass, he won't rob anyone again, ever. So **** the mother****er. If he's ****ing stupid enough to be a criminal, he deserves to get his ass shot off.

I hope you never get drunk enough that you enter the wrong house at night.

It happened to a former co-worker of mine. She was shot dead before she could say a word.

There but for the grace of God go I. I've been drunk, very drunk before, dropped off or taken a cab home. I could have tried to enter or enter an adjacent apartment, the doors all look the same in an alcoholic stupor.

Such is the result of your notions. Shoot first, ask questions later. 100 guilty persons escaping is a small price to pay for the life of an innocent.

[DinoDoc]

Why should neighbors be subjected to drunk people breaking into thier house?

[child of Thor]

cool - interesting stuff guys

The reason for the bbc article and the comments by the head of Police was because of a number of recent murders by burglers in london.
At the momment we are allowed to use 'resonable force' to protect ourselves, but this is extremely vague - and in cases like the ones mentioned in the article, if in the the uk you get attacked in your own home by an intruder carrying a knife for example, if you used a baseball bat to knock the guy out, or try to smash his knife weilding hands; you would not be using 'reasonable force' in most cases.
Here its like you have to be a total victim to get any protection from the law, and sadly in the case's of the two recently murded men, their aggressors were prepared to use way over 'reasonable force' to try to rob them.

I agree with Urban Ranger when he was saying about the problem with very free gun laws is that you can end up in an arms race with the burgler. He will carry a gun into your house, just in case you have one.

Still i like the texan approach - in atleast if you are the intruder you know what your actions could cost you.
Still the story of wondering into the wrong house in texas while drunk is rather sobering!

Its a difficult one to call, and probably why our laws in the uk are so pathetic in this respect.

Still i know what i'd do in a burgler incident, with our current laws.
For one thing i wouldn't call the police. I'll try to talk the guy down, basically tell him that unless he leaves he wont be leaving at all.
So he has a choice, and if he thinks its bull, thats his problem.
If he has a gun(which is actually quite rare in the uk, outside of streetgangs and drug dealers), then i'll just have to take a differnt approach.

Ok i'll be taking the risk of facing a long prison sentence if it goes wrong, BUT my view is that someone with intent to threaten those close to me, or myself in my own home - doesn't deserve to walk this earth. I dont go poking around in their homes, as is the case with most decent people.

I'm hopeing the news laws we may get in the uk get a bit closer to this, without going as extreme as is the case in texas(with guns etc), atleast we should start to protect the victims of crime without the cost of innocent life(and as in the case of the two murderd men in the article, the damage done to young kids who now have no father).

[Chemical Ollie]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
Why should neighbors be subjected to drunk people breaking into thier house?

Death penalty for being drunk and trying to get home to sleep?

[Chemical Ollie]

My brother had a pet crow (the bird) for a while. One night when he was on sailing holiday, a burglar broke into his yacht, and the crow attacked him with it's large beak, all while making the loud charactaristic crow noises in the darkness. The burglar dropped his Maglite and ran for his life. So, my brother got a Maglite and the burglar got nothing.

[Cruddy]

Hmm... death for breaking and entering seems a little harsh.

I see it as more a problem of public ignorance than weakness of the law. Most people just don't understand - indeed, are never taught - their rights and obligations.

It is permissible to use reasonable force to defend your home or property. It is thus permissible to use deadly force if life or lives are in danger - you'll still get investigated but the inquest should rule it as "lawful killing" and it will never reach court. If it does and you are found guilty, it should be easy to successfully appeal, assuming you didn't go over the top (sowing your garden with landmines, using a flamethrower or similar).

Trouble is, most people don't know this, don't think about it. Including the cops.

No wonder lawyers make so much money.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Chemical Ollie


Death penalty for being drunk and trying to get home to sleep?

My pity for stupid people doesn't extend very far.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by child of Thor
At the momment we are allowed to use 'resonable force' to protect ourselves, but this is extremely vague - and in cases like the ones mentioned in the article, if in the the uk you get attacked in your own home by an intruder carrying a knife for example, if you used a baseball bat to knock the guy out, or try to smash his knife weilding hands; you would not be using 'reasonable force' in most cases.

Yeah, "reasonable force" should be better defined. It seems to me that it's only fair that you can use a baseball bat or a golf club if the intruder has a knife.

[child of Thor]

Originally posted by Cruddy
Hmm... death for breaking and entering seems a little harsh.

....edit.....

Well if your the burgler trying to get into my property i expect so
Still he has a choice - to not try to burgle me in the first place, if he crosses that line he is mine and will atleast not burgle anymore decent folks. I feel quite strongly about this. It will be interesting to see how far any ammendment to the law goes and if the political parties will use it as a vote winner. I dont think robbers get much sympathy from the general public, which is fair.

[Sprayber]

Originally posted by Dauphin


I dislike your analogy for a number of reasons, but ignoring those I would say that even the macro example falls under the 'proportional response' edict.

Like I would be inclined to believe a damned thing someone who is robbing my house would say. I have no assurance that he is merely buying time or waiting for distraction or whatever. The second he broke into the house he lost the benifit of the doubt in my eyes.