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  • #16
    Originally posted by Oerdin
    Then please take a Political Science class and learn the difference between facism and nationalism. Once you have become educated we can talk again.


    Nationalism == World War One
    Fascism == World War Two

    Blog | Civ2 Scenario League | leo.petr at gmail.com

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    • #17
      Good, now I know who to blame when the **** really hits the fan under a second Bush presidency
      ku eshte shpata eshte feja
      Where the Sword is, There lies religion

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Drachasor
        And what's wrong with the EU?

        -Drachasor
        Nothing as long as it isn't forced down peoples throats and they are freely given a choice. I do have major issues with the way the EU seems to be run through back room deals by unelected elites who think it is disdainful to give common citizens a say.

        You see those little people might not vote the way the elites want them to so the elites much prefer the commoners not have the right to vote on anything important.
        Try http://wordforge.net/index.php for discussion and debate.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Oerdin


          There is nothing wrong with being a Nationalist. I realize that the modern European leftist wants to try to pretend nationalism is bad but that is just because they're trying to push the EU on people and love for one's country gets in the way of that.
          I'm pro-EU because I love my country.
          Exult in your existence, because that very process has blundered unwittingly on its own negation. Only a small, local negation, to be sure: only one species, and only a minority of that species; but there lies hope. [...] Stand tall, Bipedal Ape. The shark may outswim you, the cheetah outrun you, the swift outfly you, the capuchin outclimb you, the elephant outpower you, the redwood outlast you. But you have the biggest gifts of all: the gift of understanding the ruthlessly cruel process that gave us all existence [and the] gift of revulsion against its implications.
          -Richard Dawkins

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          • #20
            Then please take a Political Science class and learn the difference between facism and nationalism. Once you have become educated we can talk again.
            St Leo... also Fascism = applied nationalism. You live in the US... surely the elements of fascism are painfully obvious to you?

            And what's wrong with the EU?
            The CAP. Half of the EU's budget goes on subsidising European farmers to produce a more expensive crop at the taxpayers expense, a few thousand individuals are being maintained by governments while the third world starves... and yet it has the capacity to produce more food and a cheaper price. Only because the farmers have a loud political voice... they can pull at nationalistic and traditionalist heartstrings .
            "I work in IT so I'd be buggered without a computer" - Words of wisdom from Provost Harrison
            "You can be wrong AND jewish" - Wiglaf :love:

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Oerdin


              Then please take a Political Science class and learn the difference between facism and nationalism. Once you have become educated we can talk again.
              By definition fascism is the exaltation of nationalism... And I do actually study in political science

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              • #22
                You see those little people might not vote the way the elites want them to so the elites much prefer the commoners not have the right to vote on anything important.
                That's what I like about the EU. Why should the people be given a say? The logic is pathetic. I'd rather a country is run by intellectuals who know what they're doing, who've studied, history, law, psychological, sociology, economics, philosophy and the rest of it, rather than the consensus of millions of lay people who only know of their own self-interest.
                "I work in IT so I'd be buggered without a computer" - Words of wisdom from Provost Harrison
                "You can be wrong AND jewish" - Wiglaf :love:

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by Whaleboy
                  St Leo... also Fascism = applied nationalism. You live in the US... surely the elements of fascism are painfully obvious to you?


                  The US? Pah! Why would I want to live in the 11th Province? The other 10 provinces and 3 territories suit me just fine.
                  Blog | Civ2 Scenario League | leo.petr at gmail.com

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Oerdin Nothing as long as it isn't forced down peoples throats and they are freely given a choice. I do have major issues with the way the EU seems to be run through back room deals by unelected elites who think it is disdainful to give common citizens a say.

                    You see those little people might not vote the way the elites want them to so the elites much prefer the commoners not have the right to vote on anything important.
                    Are you sure that you are describing the EU and not the US?

                    Actually I think it's a totally valid criticism but I don't think that it doesn't apply to the US. Look at all the unelected presidential 'advisors' or the massive amounts of money given by lobbiests, corporations etc.

                    Actually I think that you could say that it applies to just about every political system in history...

                    Nothing wrong with being nationalist/patriotic. Everything wrong with assuming that means that you can't criticise or allow to be criticised anything about your country.
                    Jon Miller: MikeH speaks the truth
                    Jon Miller: MikeH is a shockingly revolting dolt and a masturbatory urine-reeking sideshow freak whose word is as valuable as an aging cow paddy.
                    We've got both kinds

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                    • #25
                      St Leo: Trouble in the colonies eh?
                      "I work in IT so I'd be buggered without a computer" - Words of wisdom from Provost Harrison
                      "You can be wrong AND jewish" - Wiglaf :love:

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by MikeH
                        Nothing wrong with being nationalist/patriotic.
                        Originally posted by Herman Goering
                        "Of course the people don't want war. But after all, it's the leaders of the country who determine the policy, and it's always a simple matter to drag the people along whether it's a democracy, a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism, and exposing the country to greater danger."
                        "I work in IT so I'd be buggered without a computer" - Words of wisdom from Provost Harrison
                        "You can be wrong AND jewish" - Wiglaf :love:

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                        • #27
                          Wow, leave for lunch and look what happened.

                          Originally posted by Drachasor
                          Why bother posting and saying people can comment if you've admitted that NOTHING can sway your opinion?
                          Nothing Kerry could say, could sway me. I'm interested in the comments from you guys. The vote has been cast.

                          I'm not in a swing state. Tennessee.

                          I posted this to express it, to get it out of my system.
                          "What did you learn in school today, dear little boy of mine?
                          I learned our government must be strong. It's always right and never wrong,.....that's what I learned in school."
                          --- Tom Paxton song ('63)

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by FrosT37
                            By definition fascism is the exaltation of nationalism... And I do actually study in political science
                            Survey says... BUZZ!!!!!! Thank you for play but you get some nice consolation prizes.

                            Fascism most certainly does appeal to nationalist instincts with in the population; however, fascism also has a distinct economic and political system. The fascist believes that the entire economy must be organized in such a way as to benefit the state. Thus free enterprise is only accepted when it cooperates to achieve the goals set by the fascist government.

                            Nationalists all love their country to a greater or lesser degree and they want their country to do well, but, nationalism is considered an immature political philosophy because it does not develop further then that. Unlike say socialism, communism, or fascism there is not an over riding plan for how society should be ordered. That means nationalism can be attached to most other political and/or economic philosphies without ill effect.
                            Last edited by Dinner; October 26, 2004, 11:49.
                            Try http://wordforge.net/index.php for discussion and debate.

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                            • #29
                              Other titles that could have worked for this thread:


                              "Why I voted for four more years of lies, deception, and corruption"

                              "Why I did something stupid"

                              "Why I made a bad mistake"

                              "Why I voted for four more years of incompetence and double talk"
                              A lot of Republicans are not racist, but a lot of racists are Republican.

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                              • #30
                                Oerdin this reminds me of a thread you started over a year ago strawmanning me (my argument was similar to Mills in my sig).... went on for about 6 pages until I was able to come online, I posted and you never returned .
                                "I work in IT so I'd be buggered without a computer" - Words of wisdom from Provost Harrison
                                "You can be wrong AND jewish" - Wiglaf :love:

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