Why was Reagan better than Bush?

[notyoueither]

The torture bit is where Bush lost me. I suspect the same would be true for many foreign centrists and moderate conservatives who would otherwise be sympathetic to America's cause.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Striker

Bush is just a wannabe Reagan. He tries to talk the talk and attempts to walk to the walk, but fails in the walking. Reagan never led us to a war which may not have an ending. His 'wars' were quick interventions, where we got in and got out. Or, if we knew that it would be a long and bloody war, Reagan didn't send US troops there, but send money and arms instead. Bush didn't learn that lesson.

And while Bush has pissed off the governments and people of Europe, only some people were pissed with Reagan. Reagan commanded the respect and friendship of the governments of Europe (France included) and to a great degree it was because Reagan showed respect to Europe himself.

And don't forget that he worked with the opposition parties who controled the House during his whole term and the Senate for most of it. He actually did bring in the other side and treated them with dignity and respect (listen to Tip O'Neill's staff talk about their friendly relationship). Bush pretends the Dems don't exist and respect is the last thing they are treated with.

And don't discount optimism. During that era it was needed. Fear is not needed in this era.

[Ned]

Yeah, Mondale was a Northern liberal who said he would raise taxes as the economy was just coming out of a recession. Kerry is a Northern liberal who said he would raise taxes as the economy is coming out of a long "recession." Does that make Kerry incompetent?

Please be consistent in any response.

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten
Like I said, Ted, you're viewing it all through hindsight. Try putting yourself into 1984 and see how great Reagan's presidency looks.

It looked fine to me at the time, again as a foreigner.

[chequita guevara]

The difference, Ned, this time around is, most people agree, we need to raise taxes. It's not hurting Kerry the way it hurt Fritz. Hell, we needed to raise taxes last time, but no one wanted to hear it. Know thy audience is the rule.

[Ted Striker]

What I can't stand the most is how the adminstration refuses to hear bad news.

It's like they have a plan, they stick to it, and refuse to adjust the plan, even in the slightest, when the plan goes wrong.

When something goes wrong, you observe the situation, and you adjust to it. You don't just say, "okay we'll just will our way to win." Having a strong will is great, but not observing the situation at hand is foolish, bordering on immoral, when there are other people's lives at stake.

Even the first lady, I read an interview with her, and she said things like, "I don't read the bad things they write about my husband," or, "they are just not accurate."

Anyway, regarding the torture, Cheney responded by trying to cover it up as best he could, and not owning up to it, and not condemning it.

Bush's apologies were nice but they weren't enough.

Secondly when the administration put out it's formal stance on torture, it was a joke.

Not only from a moral perspective, but from a practical perspective, torture just DOES NOT WORK.

[Ted Striker]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Striker

Bush is just a wannabe Reagan. He tries to talk the talk and attempts to walk to the walk, but fails in the walking. Reagan never led us to a war which may not have an ending. His 'wars' were quick interventions, where we got in and got out. Or, if we knew that it would be a long and bloody war, Reagan didn't send US troops there, but send money and arms instead. Bush didn't learn that lesson.

And while Bush has pissed off the governments and people of Europe, only some people were pissed with Reagan. Reagan commanded the respect and friendship of the governments of Europe (France included) and to a great degree it was because Reagan showed respect to Europe himself.

And don't forget that he worked with the opposition parties who controled the House during his whole term and the Senate for most of it. He actually did bring in the other side and treated them with dignity and respect (listen to Tip O'Neill's staff talk about their friendly relationship). Bush pretends the Dems don't exist and respect is the last thing they are treated with.

And don't discount optimism. During that era it was needed. Fear is not needed in this era.

Reagan = Making friends, leading into a victory.

Bush = Making enemies, no end game, "we're just going to do a bunch of stuff and hope it's good"

[chequita guevara]

Even Ronnie admitted to making mistakes.

[chequita guevara]

After Ronnie was gone, we knew it was the end of an era. Something fundimental had changed in the country. After Bush, there will be a sense of enormous relief.

[Ted Striker]

I hope so Commie.

[DinoDoc]

Neo-cons are stupid! Throw rocks at them! Damn liberals!

[Drake Tungsten]

Fear is not needed in this era.

Tell that to the victims of 9/11. They might still be alive if we had been a little more afraid of terrorism...

[DinoDoc]

If Bush had done everything the same wrt Iraq but not send troops in, he'd go down as one of the greatest statesmen in recent history for singlehandedly reinvigorating the containment regime at the UN that had been weakening due to French pressure.

[Jaguar]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
The difference, Ned, this time around is, most people agree, we need to raise taxes. It's not hurting Kerry the way it hurt Fritz. Hell, we needed to raise taxes last time, but no one wanted to hear it. Know thy audience is the rule.

Of course everybody wants to raise taxes...






IN BIZARRO LAND!!

[Drake Tungsten]

It's like they have a plan, they stick to it, and refuse to adjust the plan, even in the slightest, when the plan goes wrong.

WTF are you talking about, playa? Have you not been following events in Iraq at all? They've adjusted the plan there countless times in response to the changing situation.