The Social Contract?

[Berzerker]

I was just watching Pete Petersen on MSNBC talking about how social programs are killing us and he put the "social contract" nonsense to rest. This social contract is an ambiguous (intentionally I believe) "justification" for a variety of social programs that we "owe" to others as part of this "contract".

The problem: social spending is bankrupting the country.

We're something like $20 trillion in debt because of future outlays for entitlement programs, etc... So Petersen "asked" his granddaughter if she agreed to adults leaving her with all the higher taxes to pay for what we wouldn't pay ourselves.

[General Ludd]

If you don't spend money on social spending, what the hell else are you going to spend it on?


Oh yeah, more bombs. yay.

[Imran Siddiqui]

No one has ever said the social contract is a actual thing. It is always been an abstraction, and explained as something needed for an ordered society.

[reds4ever]

Weve had it in the UK since the 30's, whether it's considered a good thing or not,well IMHO, it is!

[Solomwi]

Bombs and tax rebates

[Berzerker]

Maybe you Brits don't pile up debt like we do, the problem here is that future generations we'll "educate" in government schools to embrace this "contract" are being stuck with our promises of future spending. It's one thing to force your fellow man to pay for what you want from government, it's worse to burden your own children.

[Berzerker]

If the bombs will protect me and my family, I'll help pay for them.

[General Ludd]

Originally posted by Berzerker
If the bombs will protect me and my family, I'll help pay for them.

So you'll only pay for them if they help you socially?

And you expect other people to pay for stuff to defend you?

****ing commie leach.


Or...


But you won't pay for services that will help protect you and your family? It has to be in the form of an explosive for it to be accepatble to you?

[Al B. Sure!]

you libertarians are so silly...

[reds4ever]

Originally posted by Berzerker
Maybe you Brits don't pile up debt like we do, the problem here is that future generations we'll "educate" in government schools to embrace this "contract" are being stuck with our promises of future spending. It's one thing to force your fellow man to pay for what you want from government, it's worse to burden your own children.

No were in the same boat, the pension contributions made by workers today are paying retired peoples pensions today.

It's a 'pensions timebomb' , weve got a small workforce that needs to support a lot of retired people.

[Al B. Sure!]

FDR was such a clever man for keeping the welfare state going... we can't stop s. security now because the old timers already paid for it and it wouldn't be fair if they didn't get their money back.

[reds4ever]

Originally posted by Albert Speer
FDR was such a clever man for keeping the welfare state going... we can't stop s. security now because the old timers already paid for it and it wouldn't be fair if they didn't get their money back.

[Blake]

The thing is, all the old debts can be just written off anyway. Like say the global economy gets a bit poopy and then collapses. So a new money standard is created [probably backed to make people value it], all old money is worthless.
All the accumulated "wealth" is still around, the fences, factories, skyscrapers dont disappear because all savings, debts and investments have been written off. It's just a matter of reallocating resources to people under the new system. How that works really depends who has power after the revolution.

For example lets say the Goverments retain power somehow and sieze all assets, issuing new currency, running a social credit style economy. Just like that, all the national debts are gone. Theres no debt for the children to pay, and they get to enjoy all the infrastructure.

The thing is, those who currentely have the money, that is the tiny %age of the population who control a large %age of the wealth, are going to fiercely resist a "wipe the slate clean scenario", so the only way it can happen is everyone loses faith in the old money, thus stripping the very wealthy of their power. (but theres really nothing stopping them from re-accumulating power under the new system)

[Al B. Sure!]

i'm not much of a fan of social security but we got our hands tied on this one. nothing we conservatives or yall libertarians can do about that. the democrats were clever on that one.

[Berzerker]

So you'll only pay for them if they help you socially?

Bombs aren't a social program, they help protect me from people who would kill me.

And you expect other people to pay for stuff to defend you?

Nope, did I say that?

****ing commie leach.

You're projecting.

Or...


But you won't pay for services that will help protect you and your family? It has to be in the form of an explosive for it to be accepatble to you?

I've decided bombs help protect me and my family, I have also decided working so somebody else's kid can learn from the state to impose this "social contract" on my kids in the future doesn't protect me and my family.