Rugby - Truck and Trailer!

[Havak]

Then again, Kaplan let them get away with murder most of the night!

He seemed to get very confused with offside around the ruck all game. It wasn’t all one way although the ABs were by far the worst offenders this outing.

I think he's lost a lot of confidence. His dud restart that didn't go the ten was symptomatic.

He lasted all of a minute after that – it’s one of the reasons I think he needs to worry. Graham clearly is running out of empathy for him.

At times, I could've sworn they were coached to be deliberately offside. Why?, I can't imagine.

When Graham has a game plan he does not let something as trivial as the fact it is not working make him change it.

He was inflexible in the way he coached Wales and the Lions. I simply cannot believe he has changed enough to be good for the ABs.

It pains me to say it but we have to remove the England tests from the equation – they were not facing a side there capable of asking them questions. We have to look at his other games at the helm and thus far is he blowing anyones skirt up?

Watch it again. Plank went out there to niggle Jack all night, to distract him.

I am sure it was deliberate this time. The problem is even when it is game plan Justin gets really into his method acting. At one point there was a small scuffle with jack and Plank was definitely ready to rumble – and that defeats the wind up plan as you are then just as likely to walk yourself.

Bless the lad – he is a red card waiting to happen.

And his approach to advantage was unfathomable.

It was actually more what you would expect from the worst of NH refs (ie. Welshies like Nigel Williams or pseudo French Irishmen) Proving there really is not much difference these days?

But I was pleased to see N. Sharpe do it two weeks in a row. Very strong game again.

Yep a strong game for the lad. And the original pairing both performed much better than when the former Bok came on late on.

Lyons had a bullocking game but proved several times that his awareness is suspect (‘white line fever’ your colour commentators call it?).

Waugh and Smithy both continue to impress I have to say. Smithy is everything Clive hoped Jones would be (but isn’t). Thanks god Lewis Moody is almost ready to return and sit Jones on his arse.

I believe there's an outside chance I might have been recalling a non-try at Twickenham a couple of years ago.

I knew you were alluding to Mr Luger.

The thing about that game is we dominated every aspect of play but the scoreboard. Or maybe I’m joking? You make the call.

He's the one who made the terribly nervous debut at Twickenham two years ago. Eddie picked him to tour before he'd played S12.

I remember it – he totally failed to impress. I think I even said so at the time. He is a very different player now – that is what confidence and experience does for youth?

Without Flatley, and without Roff and Burke, our problem will be a reliable goal kicker.

You are not alone in that. The ABs have similar problems. As do England (Hodgson can kick but he disappointed me hugely when he failed the test in all other aspects of the 10 shirt).

In the Boks next two games I would like your opinion of Van Der Westhuyzen. It’s not often I can say that our club has lit the touch paper on an international career but since Deano played him at stand off in December the lad has gone from strength to strength for club and country in that position. It’s the Tigers influence you see – feel free to send the best Aussies up fopr a spell with us too.

Oh yes the elder Mauger brother (Nathan) has signed for Gloucester. And in a typical piece of jiggery pokery will not be an overseas player for long. He is buying a French passport from tamerlin. Actually his mothers side of the family has French blood so he is applying for a French passport – I kid you not. When he becomes French he becomes a domestic player (avoiding the foreign player quotas) because France are in the EC and EC citizens count as resident nationals anywhere in the EC. It’s not quite as blatant a fiddle as the ABs picking Islanders but it is our nearest equivalent.

[Havak]

Talking of Plank I see that he was cleared by a citing panel after the game. Accused of 'gouging' (and anyone guilty of this should be banned permanently IMO).

The ABs Marshall may now face discipline from his own Union after giving a newspaper interview where he didn't accuse Plank directly but did link him to an incident where he suffered a pain in his eyes and called him a player with "a history of being niggly and annoying."

Eddie Jones , god bless his overt double standards in life, said "To come out now and put a slur on a player is very, very poor behaviour. He could be in a bit of trouble as the accusation he made was dealt with."

Please start the stop watch for me Finbar. Time exactly how long it is before Eddie himself next accuses a player/team of foul play despite them being cleared by officials.

In some ways you know Eddie is just as daft as Sir Clive in what he says to the media. Leave shimself wide open to be hoist by his own petard?

[finbar]

Originally posted by Havak
It pains me to say it but we have to remove the England tests from the equation – they were not facing a side there capable of asking them questions. We have to look at his other games at the helm and thus far is he blowing anyones skirt up?

Interesting point. They had McCaw and Robinson available against you, and, perhaps most importantly, your defence was - relatively speaking - crap. Apart from missing McCaw terribly - and Robinson, perhaps to a lesser extent - it's been the strong, very aggressive defences that have shut them down. All in all, the same thing that shut them down in the World Cup semi. Perhaps not a lot has changed.

I am sure it was deliberate this time. The problem is even when it is game plan Justin gets really into his method acting. At one point there was a small scuffle with jack and Plank was definitely ready to rumble – and that defeats the wind up plan as you are then just as likely to walk yourself.

Bless the lad – he is a red card waiting to happen.

Imagine Eddie's pre-game tactical chat with Plank: go out and make a nuisance of yourself. Grannys and egg-sucking.

Lyons had a bullocking game but proved several times that his awareness is suspect (‘white line fever’ your colour commentators call it?).

Well, the try was scored eventually. That's actually indicative of one of his problems around the paddock - he charges strongly, but doesn't offload enough. Momentum can die with the tackle.

Waugh and Smithy both continue to impress I have to say. Smithy is everything Clive hoped Jones would be (but isn’t). Thanks god Lewis Moody is almost ready to return and sit Jones on his arse.

One of the Kiwi assistant coaches thought Smith could play just about anywhere from 1 to 15 such are his all-round skills. A mild exaggeration, but he's gifted. I remember once saying he had aboriginal blood. I only discovered last weekend that he has North Auckland blood! Tongan.

The thing about that game is we dominated every aspect of play but the scoreboard. Or maybe I’m joking? You make the call.

Well, the ABs dominated us (the first time) and the Boks and just fell in. And they can't score tries either. So much in common.

I remember it – he totally failed to impress. I think I even said so at the time. He is a very different player now – that is what confidence and experience does for youth?

Yes, well, imagine debuting at Twickenham, last five minutes, close match, and it's your first match above club level.

In the Boks next two games I would like your opinion of Van Der Westhuyzen. It’s not often I can say that our club has lit the touch paper on an international career but since Deano played him at stand off in December the lad has gone from strength to strength for club and country in that position. It’s the Tigers influence you see – feel free to send the best Aussies up fopr a spell with us too.

Yes, I started watching him in their home Tests against Ireland. I recognised the name. He can play. Quick, good brain, good skills. But, and I don't know whether it's his fault or not, I reckon there's breakdown between their backs and forwards. There's coordination missing somewhere. They don't threaten enough yet, methinks.

Oh yes the elder Mauger brother (Nathan) has signed for Gloucester. And in a typical piece of jiggery pokery will not be an overseas player for long. He is buying a French passport from tamerlin. Actually his mothers side of the family has French blood so he is applying for a French passport – I kid you not. When he becomes French he becomes a domestic player (avoiding the foreign player quotas) because France are in the EC and EC citizens count as resident nationals anywhere in the EC. It’s not quite as blatant a fiddle as the ABs picking Islanders but it is our nearest equivalent.

I'm not surprised the older brother nicked off. He didn't show very much when given a chance earlier this season. I'd like to know where the younger Mauger is, though. Must be injured. Anyway, if Tamerlin's happy to welcome a Taffy, I'm sure he'll claim the Kiwi. Today Gloucester, tomorrow Toulouse.

[finbar]

Originally posted by Havak
Talking of Plank I see that he was cleared by a citing panel after the game. Accused of 'gouging' (and anyone guilty of this should be banned permanently IMO).

The ABs Marshall may now face discipline from his own Union after giving a newspaper interview where he didn't accuse Plank directly but did link him to an incident where he suffered a pain in his eyes and called him a player with "a history of being niggly and annoying."

Eddie Jones , god bless his overt double standards in life, said "To come out now and put a slur on a player is very, very poor behaviour. He could be in a bit of trouble as the accusation he made was dealt with."

Please start the stop watch for me Finbar. Time exactly how long it is before Eddie himself next accuses a player/team of foul play despite them being cleared by officials.

In some ways you know Eddie is just as daft as Sir Clive in what he says to the media. Leave shimself wide open to be hoist by his own petard?

Yes, but the fundamental difference between them is that Eddie is always gracious in both victory and defeat.

[Tamerlin]

Originally posted by finbar
Sad news over there this morning. The former skipper shooting his wife?

Yes, Marc Cécillon shot his wife during a party in front of sixty persons. This is a very sad end for a former international player and the man who lead the Club Sportif de Bourgoin-Jailleu for so many, many years.

He was playing when I saw him against the Stade Toulousain in 1996 for the last final of the French Championship played at the dear old Parc des Princes, without a doubt the most tensed final and the most wonderful atmosphere I have seen live in Paris.

[Tamerlin]

Originally posted by finbar
I think he's only ever played a bit of 9, mainly 10 and 12. I think he'll stay a back-up 10 and 12. There are a couple of younger, specialist fullbacks coming through. Without Flatley, and without Roff and Burke, our problem will be a reliable goal kicker.

Try to score some tries for a change!

[Tamerlin]

Originally posted by Havak
Oh yes the elder Mauger brother (Nathan) has signed for Gloucester. And in a typical piece of jiggery pokery will not be an overseas player for long. He is buying a French passport from tamerlin. Actually his mothers side of the family has French blood so he is applying for a French passport – I kid you not. When he becomes French he becomes a domestic player (avoiding the foreign player quotas) because France are in the EC and EC citizens count as resident nationals anywhere in the EC. It’s not quite as blatant a fiddle as the ABs picking Islanders but it is our nearest equivalent.

We like our foreign players to have a basic training before they come in France. This is why they are encouraged to find a job in an English team for one or two years before crossing the French border.

[finbar]

Originally posted by Tamerlin


Yes, Marc Cécillon shot his wife during a party in front of sixty persons. This is a very sad end for a former international player and the man who lead the Club Sportif de Bourgoin-Jailleu for so many, many years.

He was playing when I saw him against the Stade Toulousain in 1996 for the last final of the French Championship played at the dear old Parc des Princes, without a doubt the most tensed final and the most wonderful atmosphere I have seen live in Paris.

I read - or heard - that he'd been having seriou emotional problems adjusting to life after rugby. Playing, that is.

[finbar]

Originally posted by Tamerlin

Try to score some tries for a change!

Sorry, I think you have me confused with an England or All Blacks supporter.

[finbar]

Carlos out of the team altogether for this weekend, Mehrtens starting, with Evans as back up on the bench.

*Havak opens his cheque book*

And I notice Mauger The Younger makes an appearance on the bench. I still don't know where he's been.

[Havak]

They had McCaw and Robinson available against you, and, perhaps most importantly, your defence was - relatively speaking – crap

One of the most interesting things to see in the autumn will be the changes to our squad. The ‘rested’ players seem certain to come straight back in and one or two of the key injuries should be back – most notably Wilko of course but also Moody (who should make a huge difference) and Vickery (who I fear has shot it).

Clive also needs to make some courageous decisions – ditch Woodman as he is a liability, get rid of Jones until he learns how to handle physical opponents and for gods sake take the captaincy off of gormless. Ben Kay for skipper I say.

Will Skinner, Neil Backs protégé at Tigers, is in the England Academy squad – this should see him in the senior squad within 12 months (the same way Ellis the scrummie progressed).

Momentum can die with the tackle.

He did get turned over several times after superb bullocking runs. It must break a skippers heart.

Thanks for the image of Eddie coaching Plank in being niggly.

I remember once saying he had aboriginal blood. I only discovered last weekend that he has North Auckland blood! Tongan.

Good player whatever his background. Long since got used to tri-nations teams consisting of multi-national talent. At least with the boks it normally just means Zimbabwe and Namibia.

Well, the ABs dominated us (the first time) and the Boks and just fell in. And they can't score tries either. So much in common.

A lot of parallels with England are coming through. They must be worried.

Yes, well, imagine debuting at Twickenham, last five minutes, close match, and it's your first match above club level.

Pre Dallaglio’s second stint in charge it was a very intimidating place to play so I can empathise with him.

But, and I don't know whether it's his fault or not, I reckon there's breakdown between their backs and forwards

I suspect this is happening in the Centres because it was not a problem for him at Tigers (where he had Gibson and Smith outside him of course).

Today Gloucester, tomorrow Toulouse.

That’s like saying today Cairns RFC, tomorrow Brumbies. There’s no comparison between the turgid Glaws and the French aristocrats of the game. Glaws have won bugger all in their history after all.

Yes, but the fundamental difference between them is that Eddie is always gracious in both victory and defeat.

Gracious after winning certainly. Not always gracious after defeat (show me an Aussie who is?) – has to been known to have the odd bleat or two and has certainly criticised officials post match. Look back to the comments after the Luger wonder try for example?

We like our foreign players to have a basic training before they come in France. This is why they are encouraged to find a job in an English team for one or two years before crossing the French border.

Yes we do have to break them in. Many get confused when the referee first uses a whistle in the match – they simply are not used to it.

*Havak opens his cheque book*

Here is the thing though Finbar – VD Westhuyzen rejoins us next July. If we did sign Carlos there is a very real chance he would be surplus to requirements at that time. And he isn’t go to sign a 12 month deal – who would? Of the two right now give me the Bok anytime because he has a good rugby brain. Carlos can be a mercurial player but there’s that huge question mark over his ability to think on the field – and change his play accordingly. Plus a Fly half who goes AWOL from the pattern at Tigers will get his arse kicked by Jonno is it causes as many problems as it does for the ABs when he does it.

[Havak]

A nice little argument is brewing between the old enemies.

Steve Tew, the New Zealand Rugby Union's deputy chief executive, said no action would be taken against Marshall.

"Justin has made some comments about what he thinks occurred as he's entitled to do, as long as there's substance to his claims," Tew said.

But Jones added: "The citing commissioner looked at it and there was no case to answer so what's the substance for one player making an allegation against another player of eye-gouging, that would be my question

Go get 'em Eddie.

[finbar]

Originally posted by Havak


One of the most interesting things to see in the autumn will be the changes to our squad. The ‘rested’ players seem certain to come straight back in and one or two of the key injuries should be back – most notably Wilko of course but also Moody (who should make a huge difference) and Vickery (who I fear has shot it).

Clive also needs to make some courageous decisions – ditch Woodman as he is a liability, get rid of Jones until he learns how to handle physical opponents and for gods sake take the captaincy off of gormless. Ben Kay for skipper I say.

Will Skinner, Neil Backs protégé at Tigers, is in the England Academy squad – this should see him in the senior squad within 12 months (the same way Ellis the scrummie progressed).

Yes, but can any of them tackle?

I suspect this is happening in the Centres because it was not a problem for him at Tigers (where he had Gibson and Smith outside him of course).

You're probably right. Their centres are still looking for oppo heads to lift from their shoulders more than they're looking to link with men outside.

Gracious after winning certainly. Not always gracious after defeat (show me an Aussie who is?) – has to been known to have the odd bleat or two and has certainly criticised officials post match. Look back to the comments after the Luger wonder try for example?

A lot more gracious after defeat than You Know Who. The Luger wonder try? The Luger sham!

Here is the thing though Finbar – VD Westhuyzen rejoins us next July.

Yes, but what about his Bok commitments? July is a busy time. I take your point about Carlos, though. Look, this is his big test, as it were. Is he just an outstanding S12 player, where he has the time and space to do his thing? Can he adapt to the different demands of Test rugby?

[finbar]

Originally posted by Havak
A nice little argument is brewing between the old enemies.



Go get 'em Eddie.

The problem in all this for me is that I honestly can't see Plank as a gouger. He'll punch you in the jaw, but I don't think he's a gouger.

[Havak]

Yes, but can any of them tackle?

Wilko and Moody can. I think you know that.

Their centres are still looking for oppo heads to lift from their shoulders more than they're looking to link with men outside.

It’s been a problem for them for some time now.

Did you know incidentally that a certain former Bok skipper, the same one who called lock jaw the dirtiest player in the game just before the RWC, has signed with Northampton Saints. Saints of course are Tigers local rival and little love is lost between the two. They will meet us in the league twice this year allowing these old friends to say ‘hello’ once more.

A lot more gracious after defeat than You Know Who. The Luger wonder try? The Luger sham!

My stock answer should be “the History book will record…” or somesuch?

I am happy to go on record saying I have been disappointed with both Clive and Dallaglio’s lack of good grace since the RWC by the way.

Yes, but what about his Bok commitments? July is a busy time

Not a problem. I said July because it is when pre-season training starts. League action commences the first weekend in September – by which time the tri-nations is done and dusted.

I also suspect that unfortunately we know the answer to the Carlos question. Don’t get me wrong – I would love to see him at Welford Road in a way but at the moment given the choice VDW gets the ten shirt for me.

The reality is we will not sign him this season even is he makes himself available. The club seems ready to use Andy Goode as a kind of mentor and try to bring through Broadfoot this season before VDW returns. Carlos will probably end up at Sarries with Kafer?

The problem in all this for me is that I honestly can't see Plank as a gouger.

The problem here is a familiar one of the NZ Union not taking the disciplining of it players as seriously as it should be. We have seen it all before. Marshall has been rather silly and brought the game into disrepute – the NZ Union is doing it’s usual Ostriche thing. Problem? What problem? He was just offering an opinion. After the player had been cleared by officials.