6 US Troops charged for maltreating Iraqi jail inmates

[General Ludd]

Originally posted by the_ceebs

I read one article that said that the independent contractors could not be tried for their actions, as they fall outside as they fall outside military law. Unfortunately I don’t remember where. However whilst looking for it I found this which says that the independent contractor there is still in post.

The 60 minutes report said that. They added that none of the interogaters have had charges brought against them. (Although that report is a week or two old now, things may of changed.)

[the_ceebs]

didn't realise this was in the original tv broadcast, having only seen excerpts.

[Pekka]

Well, I think what they should now do is deliver justice and punish every single soldier who has dirt in them. And the their superiors, it is their responsibility to know what is going on, and if they didn't bother to check up, then they violated their responsibilities and are partially responsible by default anyway.

They should make it clear that this was done by individuals and they will be punished severely. Make an example of them and say this same procedure applies to anyone who does the same crap and that the supervision over these prisons will be more effective from this day on and it stops now. That's the only sensible thing to do.

[muxec]

I know the solution! Iraqi POWs should be held in Kurdish jails. This will make'em speak.

[Jac de Molay]

Tear down that prison, too. That was another bonehead idea to use what was essentially Saddam's torture factory as a US detainee center.

[Az]

just saw a couple of pics. Holy ****

[MichaeltheGreat]

Originally posted by the_ceebs


The big problem isn’t that senior politicians have explicitly ordered the mistreatment of prisoners, rather that by employing ‘independent contractors’ they have effectively provided a way where they can claim that these actions have occurred outside their control. If politicians have ordered the military to accept the orders of these individuals then they would be more responsible than the senior soldiers.

I read one article that said that the independent contractors could not be tried for their actions, as they fall outside as they fall outside military law. Unfortunately I don’t remember where. However whilst looking for it I found this which says that the independent contractor there is still in post.

Military law doesn't apply to civilians under the UCMJ (enacted by Congress in 1952 to supersede previous military law), but Federal law still applies to the conduct of US citizens overseas. Conspiracy charges are a common example, as are drug lord cases, including Manuel Noriega. Recently, there have been prosecutions of US citizens going to Thailand for "sex vacations" involving sex with young girls (preteen and early teen). If it's a priority of the administration, the Federal judicial system can handle it.

[the_ceebs]

What if they aren't US citizens?

[MichaeltheGreat]

Originally posted by the_ceebs
What if they aren't US citizens?

That's a lot murkier - Noriega, for example, isn't, and never committed any act on US territory, but the specific statutes under which he was prosecuted extended to any acts which led to illegal drugs entering the US. If there are non-US citizen contractors involved, then whether or not they could be prosecuted by the US (a sovereign Iraq is a different issue ) really is a question of what specifically they did, where, and what connection their acts had to US military or civilian personnel. There would be a lot of technical legal issues involved.

[Agathon]

Originally posted by muxec
Agathon, I bet that if you were jailguard you would behave as brutally as those USA soldiers shown on pictures.

I'll bet not. I don't have the right personality type to be in the army as it is. I can't stand being told what to do by idiots. Tests have continually shown me to be extremely independently minded and anti authoritarian. There's no way I'd join in that crap.

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Dissident
But now I suspect something is seriously wrong with americans, and they should never go to war again. Something is sick, and twisted. Our american society has hit it's worst.

I agree with everything else you said in that post, but I disagree with that particular point. I don't sick these sick scenes are specifically American. At the contrary, I think they are human, universal. That's what happen when you put ordinary people in situations like these.

This is not the American people that is sick and twisted, far from it (the collective guilt felt about it shows you are a much better people than many others). War is sick and twisted. It is in a situation of war that people can behave like beasts, like monsters, whatever their nationality. That's why we can't start wars on a whim like it happened in Iraq.

[Wezil]

Why do I get the sinking feeling this goes far beyond the six or seven convenient scapegoats? The complete and absolute lack of any concern on their faces or in their actions implies a comfort level which is disturbing. Combined with the large number of pictures I'm thinking there was something systemic going on here.

[TheBirdMan]

Take a search among the old off-topic threads.

Search fx. for prisoner.... and among many "dirty" items you will find this:

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=72225&highlight=prisoner

[GhengisFarb™]

Originally posted by Wezil
Why do I get the sinking feeling this goes far beyond the six or seven convenient scapegoats? The complete and absolute lack of any concern on their faces or in their actions implies a comfort level which is disturbing. Combined with the large number of pictures I'm thinking there was something systemic going on here.

Naw their weirdos. Strange sexual deviants that found one another as guards in an Iraqi prison.

[Ted Striker]

Originally posted by Jac de Molay
Tear down that prison, too. That was another bonehead idea to use what was essentially Saddam's torture factory as a US detainee center.

Agreed.

This needs to be done as soon as possible.