Riots in Kosovo. Albanians attack Greek peacekeepers

[East Street Trader]

Paiktis, you are plainly partisan on this. Do you believe the serbs all to be saints and the ethnic Albanians all to be monsters?

[Bereta_Eder]

Originally posted by East Street Trader
Paiktis, you are plainly partisan on this. Do you believe the serbs all to be saints and the ethnic Albanians all to be monsters?

Far far from that. There have been horryfying attrocities commited by the Serbs. I'm however always ready to point out other parameters of the conflict which are also proven. There's a lot of guilt to go around to everyone and everyone should admit his own part in it and be judged for it. Lest we create only "demon serbs", innocent victims and benevolent international community carricatures.
Reality always makes better paths to solutions and explains the present and the past.

[BeBMan]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
What concern was it of the international community to begin with?

Oh come on. A government is not always free in its decisions - imagine Clinton would have simply said "This is not our problem" while the international media is full of stories about the conflict, and when the horrors of the previous years (Bosnia) are still alive. Once the story is big enough, you can't sit there and do nothing, even when nobody actually wants to do the job.

Just take the "appeasement" rhetorics now. Can you imagine Clinton appearing in the US media as appeaser of Milosevic, as weak leader, etc?

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by BeBro


Oh come on. A government is not always free in its decisions - imagine Clinton would have simply said "This is not our problem" while the international media is full of stories about the conflict, and when the horrors of the previous years (Bosnia) are still alive.

The only substantial difference I can see between Yugoslavia and Sudan (a place with a higher body count) is that the victims were white. I'm sorry but I don't see that as sufficent reason for getting involved in an internal conflict.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by BeBro
Just take the "appeasement" rhetorics now. Can you imagine Clinton appearing in the US media as appeaser of Milosevic, as weak leader, etc?

Where are the stories about appeasing Omar al-Bashir?

[lightblue]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
The only substantial difference I can see between Yugoslavia and Sudan (a place with a higher body count) is that the victims were white. I'm sorry but I don't see that as sufficent reason for getting involved in an internal conflict.

Maybe for Americans, but for the EU having a civil war ridden country right on your doorstep is not ideal. Considering the US won't let us make our own defense force as it would devalue NATO, the US will automatically be involved if the EU are, as any EU action will run through NATO.

[Bereta_Eder]

Coming back to the present for a bit, I think this battle actually concerns the future status of Kosovo. Will it be an autonomous province? Will it remain and be returned to Serbia? The absence of a concrete future plan for Kosovo sends the message that it's up for grabs so to speak and everyone will jump on the occasion.

Granted that this absence of future plan for it was done deliberately but maybe it is now producing more problems that it originally was thought to prevent.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by lightblue
Maybe for Americans, but for the EU having a civil war ridden country right on your doorstep is not ideal.

If the French have the ability to deal with a civil war in Africa without bothering us, there is more than enough military might sitting in European countries to meddle in the internal affairs of countries residing on thier continent without involving us.

[Bereta_Eder]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
If the French have the ability to deal with a civil war in Africa without bothering us, there is more than enough military might sitting in European countries to meddle in the internal affairs of countries residing on thier continent without involving us.

You wanted to be involved and bomb Serbia that's why US and UK forces were training UCK in terrorist tactics long before there was the erruption of violence in Kosovo.

[DinoDoc]

Nevermind. I forgot my own pledge about talking to you in this thread for a moment.

[Bereta_Eder]

I thought you said you were not going to respond to me. So get on with it?

[Bereta_Eder]

After your edit consider my last post non existant.

[BeBMan]

DD:

It does not matter if we see now valid reasons when the public opinion at this time, when confronted with the news about the conflict, demanded a solution. Clinton was free to do something, or to do nothing, but doing nothing wouldn't have been without consequences for him. The thing with the superpower status is that people expect all kind of help, and you can only refuse to act if you can sell that to your public. With a civil war of that dimension within Europe, with actions quickly compared in the press to those of the Nazis, I doubt any President would have looked good when doing nothing....

And of course people have another view of things extensively covered in the media, and the entire conflict on the Balkan was indeed covered much more like other conflicts, say in Africa. it may be sad, but it is also a fact, and if we like that or not - it influences people, and it influences politics.

[DinoDoc]

It's this conflict that makes me wonder about Old Europe's demands for the UN in Iraq.

[Bereta_Eder]

As the clash was intensifying Clinton had the perfect opportunity to try and prove NATO was still relevant after the collapse of USSR. This was a golden opportunity which he couldn't pass by. It's amusing that Americans seem to believe they were dragged in on this.