If God is supreme, how does the devil rival him?

[Imran Siddiqui]

Heaven is complete and perfect spiritual union with God, and the spiritual state in which we are most happy. Hell is the state of complete and perfect isolation from God, and the spiritual state in which we are most unhappy.

In order to be in a union with God, you have to worship him. You have to be his slave. That doesn't really sound like he loves you.

[Nubclear]

But an athiest isn't with god.
So are those who do not believe in god in a constant state of misery?

[Sava]

Originally posted by Shi Huangdi
You have the wrong idea of heaven. It's not a place of a bunch of clubs and fat babies with wings playing on harps, nor is hell a cafe with a bunch of men in red tights poking you with pitchforks.

nah dude, I never said anything like that... plus, I think if heaven is anything that humans have thought of, I don't wanna go there.

Heaven is complete and perfect spiritual union with God, and the spiritual state in which we are most happy. Hell is the state of complete and perfect isolation from God, and the spiritual state in which we are most unhappy.

how do u know if you've never been there?

If you don't love God, why would you want to be in heaven and united with that which you do not love.

I would love a fair god, not an unfair one...

[monkspider]

Originally posted by jimmytrick
I believe in God. I believe that the Bible is inspired, that the Bible should be spiritually interpreted rather than literally, but God, who is a spirit, is also real, alive and among us always.

If this were so, why do you stand with those who are anti-God? Repeatedly in this forum you have defended those who stand for greed, hatred, intolerence, war, materialism, and murder? Why do you persist in doing so? And why have you chosen to shun those who espouse the philosophies of peace, brotherhood, cooperation, and love?

[Aeson]

Originally posted by Shi Huangdi
Evil is not a distinct entity onto itself Rather, it is lacking of goodness. Similar to how cold is not an entity onto itself, but rather a lack of heat.

So why the difference in choices? If God can only create perfection, not evil, and there was no temptation to chose differently (ie. no active evil such as Satan), they why would anything God created choose to "go cold", and how would they even comprehend such a choice was possible in the first place?

[MrBaggins]

Originally posted by monkspider


If this were so, why do you stand with those who are anti-God? Repeatedly in this forum you have defended those who stand for greed, hatred, intolerence, war, materialism, and murder? Why do you persist in doing so? And why have you chosen to shun those who espouse the philosophies of peace, brotherhood, cooperation, and love?

Does pro-god or anti-god have anything to do with social justice issues?

E.G.
What about a basically good priest who likes to molest young boys?

[Imran Siddiqui]

If this were so, why do you stand with those who are anti-God? Repeatedly in this forum you have defended those who stand for greed, hatred, intolerence, war, materialism, and murder? Why do you persist in doing so? And why have you chosen to shun those who espouse the philosophies of peace, brotherhood, cooperation, and love?

Wait, wait, wait. I thought YOU were the communist .

[Shi Huangdi]

"Do you have to choose before you experience each? I mean, wouldn't everyone choose where they would be most happy if they knew that's where they would be most happy?"

The way we choose is through our actions, and through our love. We would hope that people choose heaven through their actions, and seek penitence for what we do wrong. If however, we are impenitent until the end, once we die we are then outside of the world and the temporal system, and we are locked in the state we are in.

"In order to be in a union with God, you have to worship him. You have to be his slave. That doesn't really sound like he loves you."

We are not God's equal. God created us and we are part of the order he created, and in that order we are below him. The proper action is to submit ourselves to God.

"But an athiest isn't with god.
So are those who do not believe in god in a constant state of misery?"

No, they are still in the world where God still has his presence, and God and his angels can still work with athiests even if they don't know it, and we still hold hope for their salvation. In Hell however, the isolation does become permanent.

[DRoseDARs]

Originally posted by monkspider


If this were so, why do you stand with those who are anti-God? Repeatedly in this forum you have defended those who stand for greed, hatred, intolerence, war, materialism, and murder? Why do you persist in doing so? And why have you chosen to shun those who espouse the philosophies of peace, brotherhood, cooperation, and love?

Experimenting with "alternative lifestyles," perhaps? Maybe he's just confused about his spirituality; it's a phase, he'll grow out of it. He wants to have a taste of the darkside before really choosing the Light.

[Nubclear]

No, they are still in the world where God still has his presence, and God and his angels can still work with athiests even if they don't know it, and we still hold hope for their salvation. In Hell however, the isolation does become permanent.

Perhaps, however they are further away from God than a devout Christian, correct?
So will the Christian be happier than the atheist?

[Imran Siddiqui]

We are not God's equal. God created us and we are part of the order he created, and in that order we are below him. The proper action is to submit ourselves to God.

Like I said... "Better to rule in Hell than serve in Heaven".

[Aeson]

If however, we are impenitent until the end, once we die we are then outside of the world and the temporal system, and we are locked in the state we are in.

This doesn't make any sense. If God created perfect entities who then chose to become 'demons' or whatever outside the world and the temporal system then why can't someone make the opposite choice under the same circumstances? Does free will cease to exist after we die?

[Shi Huangdi]

Originally posted by Aeson


So why the difference in choices? If God can only create perfection, not evil, and there was no temptation to chose differently (ie. no active evil such as Satan), they why would anything God created choose to "go cold", and how would they even comprehend such a choice was possible in the first place?

Because God created us, and Satan moreso, so with a strong intellect and will that would be capable of comprehending such issues. Being able to comprehend the choice to love God or to not love God, and especially to have the capacity to choose to reject God, is nessecary in order to freely choose to love God. And if we did not have that choice, our love could not be genuine.

[Sava]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui

If this were so, why do you stand with those who are anti-God? Repeatedly in this forum you have defended those who stand for greed, hatred, intolerence, war, materialism, and murder? Why do you persist in doing so? And why have you chosen to shun those who espouse the philosophies of peace, brotherhood, cooperation, and love?

Wait, wait, wait. I thought YOU were the communist .

he's a christian commie.... that's like a "moderate libertarian"

[Sava]

Originally posted by Shi Huangdi
Because God created us, and Satan moreso, so with a strong intellect and will that would be capable of comprehending such issues. Being able to comprehend the choice to love God or to not love God, and especially to have the capacity to choose to reject God, is nessecary in order to freely choose to love God. And if we did not have that choice, our love could not be genuine.

but how do you know? maybe god is like that thing in star trek 5 and he is just really powerful but didn't create us...