$ Apple is Now Debt Free $

[Asher]

Originally posted by Hagbart
Before iPod was Creative Jukebox, a big bulky devise, larger and heavier than a diskman. Using USB1, tiny display, bad skip protection. Ugly as hell and anti-userfriendly.

It used the smallest hardware available at the time. The Jukebox predated the iPod by nearly three years, which is a LONG TIME in computer technology.

The iPod still isn't innovative, it's a more polished product of something Creative innovated with.

Deal with it.

[Agathon]

Raskin beats him by a year.

But not really, since as I said, the development of the GUI is down to a lot of people and cannot be traced to a linear sequence.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Hagbart
CNET has a video review of the new iPod mini.

http://news.com.com/1601-2-5159150.html

Eliot Van Buskirk, senior editor of CNET.com, describes the iPod as being innovation, apple as being ahead of all other mp3 players and the new touchsensitive clickwheel (picture below) as being a major innovation.

The clickwheel is the only buttons you need to navigate, change volume, rate songs, make playlists, turn backlight on/off.... ..... and so on.

THAT IS INNOVATION, like it or not.

Um. The Nomad Zens have always had clickwheels...

[Q Classic]

xerox parc wasn't ever really going to ship them. they were a think tank first and foremost.

and one control to do everything, hagbart? it's been seen before, you know. maybe with not so many features, but since there's prior art... it's not innovative. sorry.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Agathon
You'll believe anything he says, won't you?

Check out the facts. The Macintosh GUI was quite different from the Xerox GUI. If you bothered reading around you would find that Jef Raskin, the chief mac designer had come up with these ideas long before Xerox put them to work.

Again, you miss the point and use strawmen. No one claimed Apple copied the Xerox GUI wholesale.

Just saying they're being "innovative" is a joke, seeing as it was Xerox who innovated and Apple who took its lead. A familiar story...

[Q Classic]

and as far as cnet...

the day i take cnet to be the ultimate source of computing knowledge and the arbiter of what is and isn't innovative will be the day that i also take vogue, elle, and cosmo to be the arbiters of what is and isn't attractive on straight men who don't give much of a hoot about how they look.

[JohnT]

Upon posting, I see that Agathon went on a bit about Jef Raskin. IIRC, Raskin was on Englebarts team at SRI but didn't join Englebart when the team went to PARC in 1971/72. I've got a book at home about PARC and I'll look it up when I get there.

[Agathon]

Originally posted by Q Cubed
and as far as cnet...

the day i take cnet to be the ultimate source of computing knowledge and the arbiter of what is and isn't innovative will be the day that i also take vogue, elle, and cosmo to be the arbiters of what is and isn't attractive on straight men who don't give much of a hoot about how they look.

[GePap]

And the LORD cometh down the mountain, and he punished the Applelites, and punished the Microsofites and he said "AND YEH SHALL STOP THY BICKERING AND SILLINESS, OR THY SHALL SUFFER MY FULL WRATH", and thus HE spake, and the Applelites and Microsofites ignored the LORD, and shall be smited soon for their blasphemy.....

[JohnT]

Originally posted by Agathon
Raskin beats him by a year.

But not really, since as I said, the development of the GUI is down to a lot of people and cannot be traced to a linear sequence.

Raskin was on the same SRI project as Englebart, IIRC. Hell, he might've been the person at the other end of the videoconferencing demonstration.

Again, I'll look it up tonight.

[Agathon]

Who invented the GUI? A stack of people who, working together or separately, came up with different ideas and fed off each others' contributions.

Sounds familiar....

[Hagbart]

Originally posted by Asher

Um. The Nomad Zens have always had clickwheels...

Not the same thing.

Well it's your loss.

[Agathon]

Originally posted by JohnT


Rafkin was on the same SRI project as Englebart, Aggie. IIRC, he might've been the person at the other end of the videoconferencing demonstration.

I don't doubt it. I just wanted to clear up some misrepresentations.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Hagbart
Not the same thing.

Well it's your loss.

It's a single scrollwheel that clicks and controls every aspect of the interface.

How the hell is that not a click-wheel?

You're another Machead that doesn't know what innovation is. Everything Apple copies and changes is an innovation...

[Agathon]

Originally posted by Hagbart
Short summary of the history of personal computers:

1. Apple innovates a new product.

2. Microsoft copies it.

Repeat.

1 should really be "someone innovates a new product".