France wants to ban religious and political symbols from schools

[The diplomat]

I just saw on the website for Lemonde, that the French Legislature wants to pass a new law that would ban all religious and political symbols from public schools.

And here I thought France was about tolerance and diversity.

For those who can read French:

Les députés pour des "disposition législative" contre les signes religieux dans les écoles publiques
AFP | 12.11.03 | 14h02


La mission d'information parlementaire sur les signes religieux à l'école s'est prononcée mercredi à "l'unanimité" de ses membres pour une "disposition législative" interdisant "expressement le port visible de tout signe d'appartenance religieuse et politique" à "l'école publique", selon le relevé de conclusions obtenu par l'AFP.Cette disposition prendra la forme "soit d'un projet de loi, soit d'une proposition de loi spécifique, soit d'un amendement à un texte plus large concernant l'école".Cette interdiction à l'école publique, c'est-à-dire "dans les collèges et les lycées" a "recueilli l'unanimité des membres de la mission", selon le relevé de conclusions.Les membres de la mission présidée par le président de l'Assemblée nationale Jean-Louis Debré ont en outre exclu du champ d'application de cette interdiction les établissements privés sous contrat avec l'Etat "en raison de leur caractère propre dont le principe a été reconnu par le Conseil constitutionnel".Le projet de texte élaboré par M. Debré prévoyait d'appliquer cette interdiction dans les écoles privées sous contrat. Mais ce point n'a pas recueilli l'unanimité de membres de la mission, selon le relevé de conclusions.Un "consensus s'est dégagé pour constater qu'il n'y avait pas lieu d'appliquer cette disposition aux départements d'Alsace-Moselle compte tenu de leur régime spécifique".Les membres ont souhaité que cette interdiction du port visible de tout signe religieux soit "accompagnée de mesures" destinées à expliquer la laïcité comme "la formation obligatoire à la laïcité des personnels enseignants", "l'enseignement de la laïcité (...) dès l'école primaire" ou "l'élaboration et la diffusion de guides".

[Sliparac]

That's great news! Too bad we aren't as enlightened as the French

[oedo]

what´s wrong with it? some pupils could feel disturbed when being confronted with muslim, budddhist, hindu, scientologist or whatever symbols.

[Space05us]

trop mauvais je ne sais pas le français

[Space05us]

translation for the lazy...

The parliamentary mission of information on the religious signs at the
school decided Wednesday with "the unanimity" of its members for a
"legislative provision" prohibiting "expressement the port visible of
any sign of religious and political affiliation" at "the public
school", according to the statement of conclusions obtained by
AFP.Cette provision will take the form "either of a bill, or of a
specific private bill, or of an amendment to a broader text relating
to the école".Cette prohibition at the public school, i.e. "in the
colleges and the colleges" "collected the unanimity of the members of
the mission", from the French National Assembly Jean-Louis Debré
moreover excluded from the field of application of this prohibition
the establishments deprived under contract with the State "because of
their own character whose principle was recognized by the Council
constitutionnel".Le project of text worked out by Mr. Debré envisaged
to apply this prohibition in the schools deprived under contract. But
this point did not collect the unanimity of members of the mission,
according to the statement of conclusions.Un "consensus emerged to
note that it was not necessary to apply this provision to the
departments of the Alsace-Moselle taking into account their mode
spécifique".Les members wished that this prohibition of the visible
port of any religious sign "be accompanied by measures" intended to
explain secularity like "the obligatory formation with the secularity
of the teaching personnel", "the teaching of secularity (...) as of
the primary school" or "making and the diffusion of guides".

[Space05us]

nope, dont understand that either...

[The Templar]

Sounds good to me.

[The diplomat]

Originally posted by oedo
what´s wrong with it? some pupils could feel disturbed when being confronted with muslim, budddhist, hindu, scientologist or whatever symbols.

Are Americans the only ones who have learned of this wonderful idea called freedom of religion???

[DanielXY]

We know pretty well about freedom of (and from) religion. It means we dont have to look at a friggin cross in our class-rooms.
Public buildings have to stay neutral. I dont want my tax money get wasted for propaganda efforts.

You can wear your religios stuff all you want, but please leave me and my money alone...

[GhengisFarbâ„¢]

Re: France wants to ban religious and political symbols from schools

Originally posted by The diplomat
the French Legislature wants to pass a new law that would ban all religious and political symbols from public schools.

Wow, now they want to be just like the US. When did America's Democratic Party start lobbying for this crap in France too?

[Az]

[The diplomat]

Originally posted by DanielXY
We know pretty well about freedom of (and from) religion. It means we dont have to look at a friggin cross in our class-rooms.
Public buildings have to stay neutral. I dont want my tax money get wasted for propaganda efforts.

You can wear your religios stuff all you want, but please leave me and my money alone...

First, why are you so offended if say somone is wearing a little cross around their neck? If you are atheist, the cross does not mean anything to you, so what do you care?

So you can wear a religious symbol but only where the government says you can? That's not freedom of religion!

[oedo]

Are Americans the only ones who have learned of this wonderful idea called freedom of religion???

what Daniel said. freedom of religion does also include NOT being confronted with any confession you don´t believe in. or would you like it if your teachers would praise Allah day by day?

personally I couldn´t care less. I was in a christian school, although I turned out becoming an agnostic.

[rixxe]

Originally posted by The diplomat
First, why are you so offended if say somone is wearing a little cross around their neck? If you are atheist, the cross does not mean anything to you, so what do you care?

It's not about a religious symbol around the neck. A cross around the neck isn't constantly visible, and can be hidden under a pullower.

It's mainly about the Chador, or a cross against a wall in a classroom. I think it's normal.

Religion and politic MUST remain outside schools.

[The diplomat]

Originally posted by oedo

what Daniel said. freedom of religion does also include NOT being confronted with any confession you don´t believe in. or would you like it if your teachers would praise Allah day by day?

Freedom of religion means that someone can express their faith without government interference. So, it is not really freedom if the government can regulate your expression of religion in certain places and in certain forms.

There is a big difference between a teacher reciting the Koran out loud in class, and a person wearing a little cross? I could see how reciting the Koran out loud or reciting the Bible out loud would intrude on other people's beliefs. But there is nothing intrusive about wearing a little cross around your neck! This law goes as far as to ban any religious or political symbol in public school. A student could not even wear a little cross around the neck.