Newsflash: CNN declares Arnold new CA Gov

[Sprayber]

Originally posted by Berzerker
The Constitution says you have to be born here, but that provision will get ignored under certain circumstances. Barry Goldwater wasn't born in the USA but had he won in '64, no one would have tried to deny him the office. But we won't see that provision ignored in Arnie's case...

He was born in Arizona when it was still a territory, but it was stil the United States.

[Du_Chateau]

Los Angeles and Solano counties are still indecisive. Alameda and Tulare Counties has not been reviewed yet. At this moment the recall is losing in the bay area and in Wine Country.

[MichaeltheGreat]

IIRC, Goldwater was born in the Panama Canal Zone, a territory of the US at the time of his birth. Federal courts have long ruled that US Territories were part of the US for legal and sovereignty purposes, with the notable exception of the so-called Insular Cases from 1905-1915, when an extremely reactionary and racist SCOTUS ruled in a series of cases that the Phillipines (and by extension, other territiories full of brown people taken from Spain after the Spanish-American war) were US jurisdiction for the purposes and convenience of the US government, but not for the purposes (i.e. citizenship) of the greasy ignorant brown scum born there.

Even considering the Insular Cases, as long as the US has had territories (and most states were once US territories before being granted statehood - California was one of the few exceptions), that children of US citizens who were born in US territories were considered native US citizens, and not naturalized or granted citizens.

[The Vagabond]

Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat
Then stay in Russia. Yeah, how dare us ****ing common rabble who pay taxes actually exercise some control over the *******s who the grand party elites decide we get to pick from for elected office.

There should be some reasonable balance. You exercise control once in 4 years. But not letting a governor, who was legitimately elected and who has not violated any law, finish his term simply due to general difficulties and some unpopular measures he had to take is irresponsible populism. Add to this the victory of Arnie, who is obviously incompetent, and we obtain irresponsible populism squared.

Maybe, if you don't live or work in California, you should concern yourself with your politics, not ours.

I am rather disappointed by the tone of your reply. What, an outsider can't just state his opinion?

[Sprayber]

I think Goldwater was born in Phoenix. Are you talking about McCain?

[Berzerker]

Territories were not states and that was a point of discussion at the time he ran, not that anyone would have seriously tried to deny him the office.

[Berzerker]

Goldwater was born in the Panama Canal Zone, a territory of the US at the time of his birth. Federal courts have long ruled that US Territories were part of the US for legal and sovereignty purposes, with the notable exception of the so-called Insular Cases from 1905-1915, when an extremely reactionary and racist SCOTUS ruled in a series of cases that the Phillipines (and by extension, other territiories full of brown people taken from Spain after the Spanish-American war) were US jurisdiction for the purposes and convenience of the US government, but not for the purposes (i.e. citizenship) of the greasy ignorant brown scum born there.

Oops, I didn't know that. I thought he was born in Az, but I think he was born in 1909 so his birthdate falls into that period.

[MichaeltheGreat]

Yeah - it's McCain who was born in the Canal Zone - Goldwater was born in Arizona Territory.

[notyoueither]

OK, thanks. At least it doesn't seem to be arbitrary.

It might also be noted that British parliaments have a really nasty sort of recall for leaders. Ask Thatcher about it.

[Dis]

obviously incompetant?

now you are just trolling. how do you know he's incompetant? he hasn't even been in office?

[MichaeltheGreat]

Originally posted by Berzerker


Oops, I didn't know that. I thought he was born in Az, but I think he was born in 1909 so his birthdate falls into that period.

See my correction, courtesy of Spray.

Although the same thing applies with McCain, since he was a primary candidate.

[Berzerker]

I doubt Arnie's incompetent, he seems to succeed at most everything he goes for. I'd sooner trust someone who has made it in "private" life than a career pol who stays in power based on his ability to buy votes. I forget who said it (maybe it was that french guy who came here in the 1830's), but it goes like this - America will go bankrupt when the people discover they can simply vote themselves money from the treasury.

[Shi Huangdi]

Well, that was a truly a surreal election. Anybody thoughts on the potential impact for national elections?

Watching the TV coverage many of the Democratic Analysts seemed to be concern that now California might be in play for the 2004 elections. Well, for one, thuis will definitely help in terms of fundraising for Bush, but beyond that I tend to see it as doubtful that a social conservative such as Bush would be able to win an election in California, it seems more likely that this election was due to short term forces(namely have an extremely incompetent governor who was disliked). I think perhaps this could be more of an issue in the downticket races if the Schwarzenegger's elections could revitalize the strength of the moderate wing of the GOP, he might be able to help out in some of the Congressional races. In 2004 the California GOP will definitely be gunning for Barbara Boxer- maybe that might actually stand a chance if they can get a moderate like Riordan to run as the Republican nominee?

[Berzerker]

Yup, got it. I don't think there has ever been a serious court challenge to a candidate from a territory as opposed to a state. Like you said, the courts have basicly said territories are as good as states wrt citizenship rights...

[Dis]

as for impact in 2004, it's too soon to tell. It all depends on what Arnold can accomplish in the next 11 or 12 months or so.