The problem with Socialism

[Nubclear]

Originally posted by The Vagabond
'Socialism' is what we had in the Soviet Union.

No, thats right-wing communism. Stalinism.

I'm too busy to read through your long posts. If you can summarize....

[Pekka]

Comrade Tassadar, to put it short, socialist system (at least the one we have) can not support itself, because it is too expensive. It keeps it wheels running, but it has lost the points why people wanted socialism in the first place in reality when it reaches it limits. We have reached ours.

[Ted Striker]

Can't you guys put an oil rig off the shore like they did in Norway and not have to worry about money?

[Pekka]

[Nubclear]

Originally posted by Pekka
Comrade Tassadar, to put it short, socialist system (at least the one we have) can not support itself, because it is too expensive. It keeps it wheels running, but it has lost the points why people wanted socialism in the first place in reality when it reaches it limits. We have reached ours.

Whats wrong with Finland (other than the obvious)? It still pretty high on the Humanitarian Delveopment Index, etc etc...

[yavoon]

Originally posted by Comrade Tassadar


Whats wrong with Finland (other than the obvious)? It still pretty high on the Humanitarian Delveopment Index, etc etc...

it is choking in its own taxes and stagnate.

[Pekka]

Read the earlier posts . But in general, I'd say there's nothing wrong with us.. I think I'm lucky to be born here and have good conditions and good childhood. There's no chance to make it here though. We are not a land of opportunity. I believe that if I work hard and succeed, I should be rewarded for it and get what I deserve. And so should everyone else. Those who are not interested about anything else than boozing around and passing out shouldn't deserve what they're deserving now (free booze money). I believe everyone should get what they deserve. We can still help people and we should, but not this way.

And the way we are going, it's only getting worse and worse. Services are more expensive every year, and the quality lower. More people lose jobs all the time, nothing real gets done about it. We have reached our maximum limits, and it's not working FOR us anymore.

[The Vagabond]

Well, you are apparently right that your 'welfare capitalism' needs some adjustment. However, if you overdo and move as far as copying the American version of welfare capitalism, this may not work for Finland either. The thing is that if the American system is enforced on Finland, 95% of the population will see their actual living standards decline. The human development index of Finland (as e.g. made out regularly by the UN) will decline too. On the other hand, a payoff for such a reform would be more opportunities for the active part of the population, and perhaps higher competitiveness of the country. Now it all comes down to national mentality. The American mentality apparently values freedom and opportunities more than well-being of the 95% of the population. Is this the case in Finland? I doubt so. The welfare component has been too much ingrained into the European mentality. Besides, Finland is a small country, and therefore doesn't need too much competitiveness. It won't be able to fully capitalize on it anyways due to the mere smallness of the country. Thus, it seems to me, for small countries it is more natural to go socialist than for big ones.

[Pekka]

No, American style adopted wouldn't work here either. We'd need to make a new modified system what would work for us. We don't have to go to extremes, like most Finns would think 'yeah that means if I lose my job I'll be dead in a week!' or other myths and extremes.

Small country and small.. so what? It's not the size of the dog in fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog!

[yavoon]

Originally posted by Pekka
No, American style adopted wouldn't work here either. We'd need to make a new modified system what would work for us. We don't have to go to extremes, like most Finns would think 'yeah that means if I lose my job I'll be dead in a week!' or other myths and extremes.

Small country and small.. so what? It's not the size of the dog in fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog!

america is not the capitalist extreme. =D. I think u'll b fine, get the EU to give u some money.

[Pekka]

EU is not the answer. Rotten system here is. It needs to be terminated ASAP. Out with the old, in with the new!

[yavoon]

Originally posted by Pekka
EU is not the answer. Rotten system here is. It needs to be terminated ASAP. Out with the old, in with the new!

fine ask them for money to change ur system!

[Pekka]

Why ask for money, we're doing just FINE! Don't get greedy there.. .

[yavoon]

Originally posted by Pekka
Why ask for money, we're doing just FINE! Don't get greedy there.. .

if u dont get greedy u'll never be capitalist!

=D

[Pekka]

Nope, we enjoy collective misery. I get my joy from knowing that no one is doing better than I am, so that kind of makes me happy. I'm at the top of the world mom, WOOHOO!