Need book advise (non-fictional, politics mostly)...!

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Ecthelion
as I have said, American realists would, due to their tendency to real politics, quite often be considered right wingers in Europe, the land of pacifist daydreaming and lefty-influenced welfare states.

there are at least a few americans who are sympathetic to welfare states, but take a "hard line" on foreign policy. Youre most likely to find this viewpoint in the New Republic. Associated to some degree with third wayism, as in UK. But, like Blairism, these guys are easily outflanked on the left on domestic policy. **** Gephardt, who was pro-Iraq war, and is pro-national health insurance, may bring attention to this if he does well in Dem primaries.

Another neo-con whose articles are well worth reading is David Brooks. Find him in the Weekly Standard.

For a discussion of American viewpoint on foreign policy theres an article (book?) somewhere by Walter Russel Meade - who talks about 4 orientations - Hamiltonian (realist/mercantilist) Jeffersonian (isolationist/idealist) Wilsonian (multilateralist) and Jacksonian (nationalist/unilateralist) These labels have begun to make their way into US discourse, especially on the right, in the last couple of years, though i dont think Meade is a rightist.

I would note that there is an element of aggressive/wilsonianianism (again, think Blairism) that is on the center of US for pol opinion, but looks right wing to continental europe (despite fischers flirtation with it) This shades off into a more moderate right wing positions, both realist and neo-con - the more sensible neo-cons are not completley hostile to multilateralism. There is a nationalism/unilateralist element that hates multilateralism on principle, and i dont think your list captures that.

[Ecthy]

"My list" was just a quickly compiled collection of books, mostly by amazon's "people who bought this also bought that", I must be honest . However, I tried picking those which I had heard the author's names of before. The ones you mentioned, apart from Mr Gephardt, are completely new to me.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Ecthelion
"My list" was just a quickly compiled collection of books, mostly by amazon's "people who bought this also bought that", I must be honest . However, I tried picking those which I had heard the author's names of before. The ones you mentioned, apart from Mr Gephardt, are completely new to me.

about your "list " - understood.

Richard Gephardt (didnt expect poly to censor the common english nickname for Richard) is a politician, not a writer.

Ledeen's latest

"The War Against the Terror Masters: Why It Happened. Where We Are Now. How We'll Win."

Doesnt sound nearly as good as Kagan to me, but hes influential on the right.

[Ecthy]

I know, he's some democrats guy, their leader in the senate or congress or so, damned if I know

As for Ledeen etc, I'm going to note down some of those names. Thing is, books aren't for free and I'm a poor guy

[Ecthy]

however, if there's a chance to read some of their articles online...

[lord of the mark]

a ledeen title from before 9/11

"Freedom Betrayed: How America Led a Global Democratic Revolution, Won the Cold War, and Walked Away"

Victor Davis Hanson is a think somewhat better than Ledeen and is also popular on the right. His latest:
" An Autumn of War: What America Learned from September 11 and the War on Terrorism"

"The Threatening Storm: The Case for Invading Iraq "by Ken Pollack is not quite the topic youre looking for, and has been passed by events. It has been highly influential and illustrates some of the flux near the center. Though widely cited on the right, Pollack is a former Clinton official, and has stated that he would have waited longer than Bush before attacking Iraq.

[Ecthy]

I've actually heard the name Pollack before... probably on some thread titles anyway

[lord of the mark]

in addition to paradise and power you might look at
" Present Dangers: Crisis and Opportunity in American Foreign and Defense Policy"

Since its a collection essays by several righters, it may lead you to other thinkers you find more interesting. Kristol, like Kagan, is a neo-con, and so I presume most of the authors in the book are as well.


And since we're tossing around the term the neo-con alot, you might try the following:

"Neo-Conservatism: The Autobiography of an Idea"
by Irving Kristol, father of neo-con (and of William Kristol), former Trotskyite, widely admired and widely reviled.

Someone who is considered a centrist/liberal here, but is rightwing by Euroleftie standards, is New York Times colomnist Tom Friedman. His latest :
"Longitudes and Attitudes: Exploring the World After September 11 "

another liberal who may be a rightie by euro standards
Fareed Zakaria:
"The Future of Freedom: Illiberal Democracy at Home and Abroad"

and multilateralist/realist Joseph Nye
"The Paradox of American Power: Why the World's Only Superpower Can't Go It Alone "

and heres the name of the Walter Russel Meade book:
"Special Providence: American Foreign Policy and How it Changed the World "

and a general background for understanding America - if you havent read De Tocqueville's "Democracy in America" you should - in addition to being very insightful about the American charecter, and some broader issues of politics and society, its very widely read among Americans who think seriously about politics, and looms in the background of much discussion.

oh and Max Boot seems to be influential among Neo-cons. see:
"The Savage Wars of Peace: Small Wars and the Rise of American Power "

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Ecthelion
I know, he's some democrats guy, their leader in the senate or congress or so, damned if I know

As for Ledeen etc, I'm going to note down some of those names. Thing is, books aren't for free and I'm a poor guy

I sympathize - if you were to buy every serious book written in america on foreign affairs and the global situation in the last year or two it would cost a small fortune.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by lord of the mark


I sympathize - if you were to buy every serious book written in america on foreign affairs and the global situation in the last year or two it would cost a small fortune.

but then that would be true for almost any subject.

[Ecthy]

that's why someone said forget all the pre-1990 cold war stuff... however, I might be going to study politics anyway, so I might end up having a lot of time for reading all that stuff

and ending up being a true American *rises from seat and sings to the Star Spangled Banner*

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Ecthelion
that's why someone said forget all the pre-1990 cold war stuff... however, I might be going to study politics anyway, so I might end up having a lot of time for reading all that stuff

and ending up being a true American *rises from seat and sings to the Star Spangled Banner*

It could be argued that the discourse has changed so much one could almost discount anything pre-9/11. Pre 9/11 i still useful background to ideological arguments, but then so is pre-1989. (Most americans who write about such things take '89 as the division of eras, not 1990) Indeed the sense that 9/11 marks a different era is one of the things that seperates Americans and Europeans, I think.

A good blog thats thoughtful and focused on geopolitics and political philosophy, and is centrist to right of center, is Oxblog (several current and former American Oxford students, from wilsonian centrists to neo-cons)

[Ecthy]

I thought of 1990 just as the general dimension.

Is there a way t osave a thread on one page? I might need all this writing (including the scratching and puffing between Boris and John ) at some point later on. And maybe the stuff that is still coming

[Ecthy]

I said is still coming

[JohnT]

Click on "Show a Printable Version." Make sure that ALL posts are on one page - if they are not, you should have the option somewhere to do so.

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