Turnplayer Thread #3

[Sullla]

OK, so for the late adjustments:

- Cape Town swapped to mace to avoid overflow. It's a bit of a waste, unfortunately, as we are essentially paying 10 extra shields for minor benefit. Still, having two maces at the Cape ain't a bad thing either. We have enough shields to go mace (currrent turn/T123), elephant (next turn/T124), cat (T125) and then start fresh, at size 6, pulling in 18 shields base/36 shields with Heroic Epic.

For the reasons sunrise explained, crossbow is not a desirable build at Cape Town.

- China Beach looks like lighthouse for the next build, although we can discuss it further next turn.

- Green Acres I have set to barracks. The call was for barracks or forge, and as helpful as a forge would be for whips, it also was going to take forever and a day (50t) to complete. I figured that we may need to do an emergency military whip at some point, and it would be a good idea to have a barracks (15t) in Green Acres in case that happened. Plus, we do need a barracks here eventually anyway, while we might not ever need the forge if we're just going to be drafting.

We can still change this if the team preference is for a forge.

I did not end the turn, as I still have some number-crunching to do later tonight. Now, the full Stats:

General

Current Turn:
Turn 123 - 200 AD
Turn Timer expires at approx (UTC)

Active Turn Player:
Sullla

Tech:
Engineering (5t)
100% research (211 [254] beakers/turn) @ -52gpt
291/1430 beakers overall

Gold
277g in treasury

Cities

Airstrip One [size 10] [guarded by Xena and Mariah]:
Forge (1t), National Epic (10t)
Infrastructure: Palace, Granary, Barracks, Library, Academy, Great Library
Great Scientist 136/200, +8 GPP/turn, due in 8t
Holding at zero growth until next cottage is finished.

Pink Dot [size 8] [guarded by Britney's Spears and Adria and Athena and Allydar]:
Horse Archer (3t)
Infrastructure: Barracks, Granary, Aqueduct, Hanging Gardens
Building some insurance military.

China Beach [size 5] [guarded by Ms Piggy]:
Horse Archer (1t) [anger duration 3t and 13t]
Infrastructure: Granary, Library, Barracks
Chop overflow into lighthouse next turn?

Cape Town [size 5] [guarded by Diana and Fyre Errow and Gillian and Jamie Lynn's Spears and Hannah and Christina and Aphrodite and Demeter and Affirmed and Akara and Nelly and Kitty]:
Maceman (1t), War Elephant (1t)
Infrastructure: Barracks, Heroic Epic, Walls

Something Fishy [size 4] [guarded by Svava]:
Forge (8t) [anger duration 3t and 13t]
Infrastructure: Granary, Library, Courthouse

Green Acres [size 3] [guarded by Robyn Hood]:
Barracks (15t) [anger duration 5t and 15t]
Infrastructure: Granary, Library, Lighthouse

Mellow Yellow [size 3] [guarded by Hera]:
Forge (19t), Library (8t) [anger duration 2t]
Infrastructure: Granary

Saxon the Beach [size 3] [guarded by Betty Hur]:
Granary (4t), Moai Statues (61t)
Infrastructure: none

Non-Combat Units

Settler [Blue Barry]:
Moving to Blue dot location in north (2t)

Worker [Winston]:
Chopping/Mining grassland hill north of China Beach
Chopping (done!)

Worker [Bernard]:
Build cottages at Airstrip One
Moving to tile (done!)

Worker [Mustapha Mond]:
Chop/road/plantation silks at Saxon the Beach
Chopping (done!)

Worker [O'Brien]:
Chopping/Farming grassland forest south of Cape Town
Farming (done!)

Worker [Helmholtz]:
Chopping/Farming grassland forest south of Cape Town
Farming (done!)

Worker [Parsons]:
Build cottages at Pink
Cottaging (done!)
Heading to Something Fishy's dyes plantation next

Worker [Syme]:
Road between Pink Dot and Cape Town
Roading (done!)

Worker [John the Savage]:
Chop/plantation/road Something Fishy's dyes
Chopping (done!)

Worker [Bob the Builder]:
Moving south to improve Mellow Yellow
Moving to tile (done!)

Worker [Serious Steve]:
Improve deer tile at Saxon the Beach
Camping deer (5t)

Worker [Energetic Erik]:
Connect Green Acres to road network
Roading (2t)

Military Units

Galley [RBS Discovery]:
Patrolling the Channel

War Elephant [Nelly]:
Guard Cape Town

Maceman [Akara]:
Guard Cape Town

Horse Archer [Allydar]:
Move to Cape Town

Horse Archer [Affirmed]:
Guard Cape Town

Catapult [Kitty]:
Guard Cape Town

Axeman [Gillian]:
Guarding Cape Town (for now)
Heading to Twin Peaks eventually

Axeman [Adria]:
Guard Pink Dot

Spearman [Mariah]:
Guard Airstrip One

Spearman [Christina]:
Guard Cape Town

Spearman [Hannah]:
Guard Cape Town

Spearman [Jamie Lynn's Spears]:
Guard Cape Town

Spearman [Britney's Spears]:
Guard Pink Dot

Chariot [Betty Hur]:
Healing up after another barb smackdown (2t)
10XP - our most heroic unit!

Chariot [Lady Godiva]:
Moving east to get intel on Imperio/Templar cities

Archer [Ms Piggy]:
Guard China Beach

Archer [Diana]:
Guard Cape Town

Archer [Billy Jean Tell]:
Exploring Imperio territory

Archer [Robyn Hood]:
Guard Green Acres

Archer [Svava]:
Guard Something Fishy

Archer [Fyre Errow]:
Guarding Cape Town (for now)
Heading to Twin Peaks eventually

Archer [Hera]:
Guard Mellow Yellow

Archer [Athena]:
Guard Pink Dot

Archer [Aphrodite]:
Guard Cape Town

Archer [Demeter]:
Move to Pink Dot

Archer [Persepone]:
Bust fog in the north to stop barbs from appearing

Warrior [Xena]:
Guard Airstrip One

Warrior [Jennifer]:
Exploring the eastern continent

Foreign Builds from C&D

Templars 162EP
Jerusalem = 30 shields (+10)
Infrastructure: Palace, Barracks
Damascus = 28 shields (+28)
Infrastructure: Terrace, Barracks, Forge
Jericho = 5 shields (+5)
Infrastructure: Walls
Acre = 2 shields (+2)
Infrastructure: Monument

I believe that Damascus finished a horse archer (50 shields) last turn, and received a lot of overflow this turn, to explain the large number there.

Imperio 216EP
Mutal = 24 shields (-16)
Infrastructure: Palace, Barracks, Granary, Monument, Stonehenge, Oracle
Lakamha = 20 shields (-21)
Infrastructure: Barracks, Monument, Islamic shrine
Chichen Itza = 46 shields (+4)
Infrastructure: Granary, Monument, Lighthouse, Barracks
Uxmal = 49 shields (+10)
Infrastructure: Monument
Mayapan = 14 shields (+7)
Infrastructure: Monument, Barracks
Calakmul = 57 shields (+7)
Infrastructure: Monument

It's really impossible to tell what Imperio is doing when they keep swapping their builds around. I'm not willing to keep multiple build tallies going at once, sorry! Probably pretty safe to say that there are maces in production at Mutal and Lakamha.

PAL 60EP
The Warning = 36 shields (+36)
Infrastructure: Granary, Barracks, Lighthouse, Library, Forge, Academy
Heliopolis = N/A, zero shields invested
Infrastructure: Granary
Alexandria = 24 shields (+12)
Infrastructure: Granary, Forge
Giza = 36 shields (+36)
Infrastructure: Granary, Lighthouse

The Warning almost certainly is getting a doubled build - maybe even more! I'd wager that they are building Colossus there in the capital, since PAL just completed a Forge, and that would account for the +150% from Industrious and copper. Heliopolis finished a build in the 40-shield range; Confucian missionary? It is their holy city, after all...

Giza likely had a forest chop added to give it so many shields at once.

Rabbits 48EP
Caerbannog = 38 shields (+24)
Infrastructure: Palace, Barracks, Library, Great Wall
Digger's Burrow = 9 shields (+4)
Infrastructure: Barracks, Monument, Granary, Walls
Phrygian = N/A, zero shields invested
Infrastructure: none

Caerbannog looks to be building something with a doubled resource, so maybe Protective walls there (?) Digger's Burrow has been pillaged into oblivion at this point. Phrygian, I dunno.


Population census:
PAL 53 (size 11,8,7,7,6,5,4,4,1)
RB 41 (10,8,5,5,4,3,3,3)
Imp 38 (10,7,7,6,5,3)
Ban 28 (9,8,5,4,2)
Tem 24 (7,7,6,3,1)
Rab 8 (4,3,1)


Treasury report:
Templars: 108gold (+4gpt)
Imperio: 274gold (+2gpt)
PAL: 184gold (+114gpt)
Rab: 35gold (+-0gpt)
Banana: 34 (+1gpt)

[Swiss Pauli]

I think we will want to whip a forge in Green before starting Globe (as we'll need all the production we can get to build it) , but a barracks right now is a better option.

[sooooo]

Well, it seems we did not change Green Acres to barracks because it put its overflow into a forge.

In important news (I was not the first team member to log in, m-h was logged in as the turn ticked over), I named our Horse Archer "Camilla" (get it?) and our new maceperson "Gladys". She insists on the the sex-neutral terms "maceperson", "swordsperson" and "axeperson" by the way.

[Sullla]

Did someone switch Green Acres back to forge? It's not a huge deal, but please don't do that if at all possible. Logging into the game to poke around is highly encouraged, swapping builds and forgetting to change them back is not.

Details from a very quiet T124:

- Airstrip One finished its forge, and is back to work on National Epic (9t). This will drop with some help from a forest chop, and should finish in about six turns, right around the time we produce our next Great Scientist. Nice timing there, I suppose.

- China Beach finished horse archer, has used the overflow for a 1t lighthouse. Yay! This will allow the city to grow in two turns instead of the three listed. We can build a forge next, or go onto another settler/worker. I think I have a slight preference for a worker or settler.

- Cape Town finishes macePERSON , back to work on elephant. Still on the mace/elephant/cat three-turn plan outlined earlier, while growing to size 6.

- I have not whipped Saxon the Beach's granary as yet, just in case we want to change our mind. I really don't think that's going to happen, but last possible chance for someone to speak up against it.

- That was basically it this turn for us. No cities grew in size, although we have three cities growing next turn, and two more cities growing in two turns, plus we'll found our ninth city at the silks resource next turn as well! So more interesting stuff coming up shortly.

- I'll also mention here that we have silk and dyes plantations underway at the moment. Something Fishy will finish its dyes plantation in a mere 2t, which is great because it only has to spend a single turn working an unimproved tile! In the larger view, we're really going to kick our economy up another level as we start working multiple dyes/silks plantations over the next dozen turns. Remember, Imperio has had gold tiles since the start of the game, and PAL has been working multiple gems tiles too. Now *WE* finally get our luxury resources into play, 125 turns into the game, and they'll give us a definite boost. Look how much value we've already gotten out of working the two wines tiles.

- Scouting picture: the RBS Discovery caught her first sight of Banana units and spotted borders at the edge of the fog:



This is directly southeast of Templars, for the curious. And, umm, it looks like that eastern continent goes a lot further south than ours... Do they have more land over there? Was that the continent with the "extra" civ that got deleted? I'm going to be (even more) frustrated if that turns out to be true!

- Since this is a quiet turn, here's a compilation shot of Imperio's military:



While it's possible they have a few more units in the fog, this really should be just about everything they have. Removing obvious garrison units, we have:

3 war elephants
1 horse archer
6 catapults
2 chariots
3-4 longbows

C&D info suggests that they may have another one or two war elephants in the fog. Still, with these current numbers, Imperio will not be getting past our defenses. No way, no how.

That's about it for this turn. No major trades have gone down internationally, just kind of an off turn for everyone. Feel free to take a look at the game, relax, and maybe think about long term strategy a bit. We'll get into a lot more micro stuff next turn.

[T-hawk]

I worked ahead the math on Green Acres. It reaches size 6 by T129, puts one turn into the settler, and whips the settler on T130. I assume working the 2-1-0 grass forest at size 4 and either a 1-3-0 mine or 1-2-0 forest at size 5. There's 3 food to spare, so precise MM isn't critical. So we should schedule worker labor for the next site (probably Twin Peaks) to be roaded and ready with one good tile by then.

What to build is still up in the air. It gets about 20 hammers before the settler, not enough to finish either forge or barracks. I'd continue on the forge now and finish it after the settler. Nationhood and Globe are still far enough away that it'll have time for the barracks later.

BTW, the event log this turn says that Mellow Yellow got Confucianism.

[T-hawk]

I also took the liberty of logging in to grab a big overview screenshot. I always want a reference like this when reading and posting from work.

BTW, where exactly is Blue Barry going? It's not marked in-game.

[Swiss Pauli]

Blue Barry is bound for the grass tile that's surrounded by silks (and sheep).

[Sullla]

Whipped the granary at Saxon the Beach and ended our turn. Hopefully the others teams will do the same, as there's little going on anywhere this turn, but I tend to doubt it.

I also noticed something: in retrospect, I should have sent Bernard up to the to-be-founded city of Blue Barry, building roads along the way, and used Helmholtz to chop/cottage at Airstrip One. It's going to take us about 6t currently to hook Blue Barry up to our road network, and that means 6t of not getting any trade route income from the city, which is a huge waste. Totally my fault, and I should have planned better.

Stats from T124:

General

Current Turn:
Turn 124 - 225 AD
Turn Timer expires at approx (UTC)

Active Turn Player:
Sullla

Tech:
Engineering (4t)
100% research (210 [253] beakers/turn) @ -55gpt
545/1430 beakers overall

Gold
225g in treasury

Cities

Airstrip One [size 10] [guarded by Xena and Mariah]:
National Epic (9t)
Infrastructure: Palace, Granary, Barracks, Library, Forge, Academy, Great Library
Great Scientist 144/200, +8 GPP/turn, due in 7t

Pink Dot [size 8] [guarded by Britney's Spears and Adria and Athena]:
Horse Archer (2t)
Infrastructure: Barracks, Granary, Aqueduct, Hanging Gardens
Building some insurance military.

China Beach [size 5] [guarded by Ms Piggy]:
Lighthouse (1t) [anger duration 2t and 12t]
Infrastructure: Granary, Library, Barracks
What to build here next? Settler/worker, infrastructure, military?

Cape Town [size 5] [guarded by Diana and Fyre Errow and Gillian and Jamie Lynn's Spears and Hannah and Christina and Aphrodite and Demeter and Affirmed and Akara and Gladys and Nelly and Kitty]:
War Elephant (1t)
Infrastructure: Barracks, Heroic Epic, Walls

Something Fishy [size 4] [guarded by Svava]:
Forge (7t) [anger duration 2t and 12t]
Infrastructure: Granary, Library, Courthouse

Green Acres [size 3] [guarded by Robyn Hood]:
Forge (49t) [anger duration 4t and 14t]
Infrastructure: Granary, Library, Lighthouse

Mellow Yellow [size 3] [guarded by Hera]:
Forge (18t), Library (8t) [anger duration 1t]
Infrastructure: Granary

Saxon the Beach [size 2] [guarded by Betty Hur]:
Granary (1t), Moai Statues (61t)
Infrastructure: none

Non-Combat Units

Settler [Blue Barry]:
Moving to Blue dot location in north (1t)

Worker [Winston]:
Chopping/Mining grassland hill north of China Beach
Mining (4t)

Worker [Bernard]:
Chop/Cottage grassland river tile at Airstrip One
Chop (3t)

Worker [Mustapha Mond]:
Chop/road/plantation silks at Saxon the Beach
Building plantation (5t)

Worker [O'Brien]:
Road between Cape Town and Pink Dot
Moving to tile (done!)

Worker [Helmholtz]:
Complete road between Airstrip One and Cape Town
Moving to tile (done!)

Worker [Parsons]:
Help build dyes plantation at Something Fishy
Moving to tile (done!)

Worker [Syme]:
Road between Pink Dot and Cape Town
Roading (3t)

Worker [John the Savage]:
Chop/plantation/road Something Fishy's dyes
Building Plantation (5t)

Worker [Bob the Builder]:
Chop/mine/road forested plains hill at Mellow Yellow
Chopping (3t)

Worker [Serious Steve]:
Improve deer tile at Saxon the Beach
Camping deer (4t)

Worker [Energetic Erik]:
Connect Green Acres to road network
Roading (done!)

Military Units

Galley [RBS Discovery]:
Patrolling the Channel

War Elephant [Nelly]:
Guard Cape Town

Maceman [Gladys]:
Guard Cape Town

Maceman [Akara]:
Guard Cape Town

Horse Archer [Camilla]:
Move to Cape Town

Horse Archer [Allydar]:
Move to Cape Town

Horse Archer [Affirmed]:
Guard Cape Town

Catapult [Kitty]:
Guard Cape Town

Axeman [Gillian]:
Guarding Cape Town (for now)
Heading to Twin Peaks eventually

Axeman [Adria]:
Guard Pink Dot

Spearman [Mariah]:
Guard Airstrip One

Spearman [Christina]:
Guard Cape Town

Spearman [Hannah]:
Guard Cape Town

Spearman [Jamie Lynn's Spears]:
Guard Cape Town

Spearman [Britney's Spears]:
Guard Pink Dot

Chariot [Betty Hur]:
Healing up after another barb smackdown (done!)
10XP - our most heroic unit!

Chariot [Lady Godiva]:
Moving east to get intel on Imperio/Templar cities

Archer [Ms Piggy]:
Guard China Beach

Archer [Diana]:
Guard Cape Town

Archer [Billy Jean Tell]:
Exploring Imperio territory

Archer [Robyn Hood]:
Guard Green Acres

Archer [Svava]:
Guard Something Fishy

Archer [Fyre Errow]:
Guarding Cape Town (for now)
Heading to Twin Peaks eventually

Archer [Hera]:
Guard Mellow Yellow

Archer [Athena]:
Guard Pink Dot

Archer [Aphrodite]:
Guard Cape Town

Archer [Demeter]:
Move to Pink Dot

Archer [Persepone]:
Bust fog in the north to stop barbs from appearing

Warrior [Xena]:
Guard Airstrip One

Warrior [Jennifer]:
Exploring the eastern continent

Foreign Builds from C&D

Templars 164EP
Jerusalem = 40 shields (+10)
Infrastructure: Palace, Barracks
Damascus = N/A, zero shields available
Infrastructure: Terrace, Barracks, Forge
Jericho = 43 shields (+38)
Infrastructure: Walls
Acre = 4 shields (+2)
Infrastructure: Monument

Damascus finishes something cheap, in the 30-35 shield range. Forest chop at Jericho, methinks.

Imperio 220EP
Mutal = 54 shields (+30)
Infrastructure: Palace, Barracks, Granary, Monument, Stonehenge, Oracle
Lakamha = 51 shields (+31)
Infrastructure: Barracks, Monument, Islamic shrine
Chichen Itza = N/A, zero shields invested
Infrastructure: Granary, Monument, Lighthouse, Barracks
Uxmal = N/A, zero shields invested
Infrastructure: Monument
Mayapan = 22 shields (+8)
Infrastructure: Monument, Barracks
Calakmul = 64 shields (+7)
Infrastructure: Monument

Looks like Imperio is still swapping around between multiple builds at once in their core cities. We just need to be aware that they likely have maces and elephants near completion in both Mutal and Lakamha. Chichen Itza finished a longbow, which we have visual sight of. Uxmal is an unknown, aside from finishing a 50-shield build. I think I'll send Lady Godiva over there next turn to investigate what was built...

PAL 62EP
The Warning = 63 shields (+27)
Infrastructure: Granary, Barracks, Lighthouse, Library, Forge, Academy
Heliopolis = 11 shields (+11)
Infrastructure: Granary
Alexandria = N/A, zero shields invested
Infrastructure: Granary, Forge
Giza = 38 shields (+2)
Infrastructure: Granary, Lighthouse
Byblos = 2 shields (-)
Infrastructure: none

I continue to believe that The Warning is building the Colossus, getting lots of production modifiers from Bureaucracy/Industrious/Copper. Alexandria built something cheap, in the 30-35 shield range. First line of sight into Byblos!

Rabbits 48EP
Caerbannog = N/A), zero shields invested
Infrastructure: Palace, Barracks, Library, Great Wall
Digger's Burrow = 13 shields (+4)
Infrastructure: Barracks, Monument, Granary, Walls
Phrygian = 16 shields (+16)
Infrastructure: none

Rabbits built something on the expensive side in Caerbannog (or swapped builds) but it wasn't a building, so I can't say what it was.


Population census:


Treasury report:

[Swiss Pauli]

Not convinced about The Warning going for Colossus: seems a bit of a weak move as Astro will be in play pretty early (even if PAL doesn't want it from Liberalism). There's quite a few wonder options, seeing as they have all the resource multipliers available.

[T-hawk]

I also noticed something: in retrospect, I should have sent Bernard up to the to-be-founded city of Blue Barry, building roads along the way.

China Beach [size 5] [guarded by Ms Piggy]:
Lighthouse (1t) [anger duration 2t and 12t]
Infrastructure: Granary, Library, Barracks
What to build here next? Settler/worker, infrastructure, military?

I think this is becoming my mantra: Worker at China Beach. Blue Barry needs lots of labor for all the silks and sheep. If whipped, this worker could help road to Blue Barry. I'll micro-analyze CB later for details on food and tiles and whip timing.

Green Acres [size 3] [guarded by Robyn Hood]:
Forge (49t) [anger duration 4t and 14t]
Infrastructure: Granary, Library, Lighthouse

Just want to note here that the plan is, when Green Acres reaches size 6, change to settler and triple-whip it. Then continue on forge.

[mostly-harmless]

Not convinced about The Warning going for Colossus: seems a bit of a weak move as Astro will be in play pretty early (even if PAL doesn't want it from Liberalism). There's quite a few wonder options, seeing as they have all the resource multipliers available.

Colossus would be a very strong move for PAL, as they have plenty of coastal cities & under-developed land tiles (look at all the jungle at Giza for example).

They are definitely going for a wonder:

We know they finished a forge a few turns back.
They were pulling ~24hpt (from C&D) for = 2.5 (ind&capital) * 10hpt (base value) during forge construction.
Now they are pulling ~27hpt (from C&D). For wonders they get a whopping 3.25 multiplier. For anything else they get only a 1.75 multiplier. The former means a base value of ~9hpt, the latter a base value of ~16hpt. I have my doubts The Warning all of a sudden increased their base value from ~10 to ~16. They have grown one pop point, but their location is a coastal/flood plain spot.
So I am sure they are on a wonder footing here.
As they have all the required resources for all available wonders, we cannot say for sure which one they are going for, but Colossus would be the most beneficial for them now.

As for Astronomy, they are sitting conveniently in the middle of everything and don't need ocean-trade routes. If they are decent MP players they will ignore the New World and can therefore delay Astronomy for quite a while. As for why they went for Optics, I think its for the caravels. They will probably have worked out that the additional +1 movement point for water units (Magellan) can be crucial for any future intercontinental warfare. And keep in mind, that PAL has zero map knowledge of anything to their west.

mh

[sunrise089]

I too think Collosus is a very strong play for PAL and expect it soon.

[T-hawk]

It's either/or: Colossus is strong if PAL is happy to delay Astronomy. Colossus is weak if they're just going to expire it right away. We'll know soon, and we aren't in a position to do anything about it anyway.

And I propose that the silks city be named Blueberry Fields Forever. (if that fits.) In addition to the pun, we have a city that we can call our BFF.

[Swiss Pauli]

I think that Temple of Artemis in the Warning would be a stronger play for PAL, but we'll find out soon enough.

[sunrise089]

It's either/or: Colossus is strong if PAL is happy to delay Astronomy. Colossus is weak if they're just going to expire it right away. We'll know soon, and we aren't in a position to do anything about it anyway.

And I propose that the silks city be named Blueberry Fields Forever. (if that fits.) In addition to the pun, we have a city that we can call our BFF.

I'm not even sure I agree with this T-Hawk. Colossus is a very cheap wonder with copper and industrious...in my games it seems to be about the easiest to build. Being able to work 3-commerce water tiles until their coastal cities are improved is pretty nice.