DIPLO: GoW comments

[DeepO]

I think we can't decide this that fast, we need more time. If that means we can't do it right now, but one turn later, so be it.

Shiber, was anything said on their 'war' with Vox? Sure, they might try to use it as a way of getting Feud from us sooner, but if it's a ruse, we would be giving them the opportunity to get to riders faster. That could become dangerous, if all would not be like it shows.

For the moment, I would not mention our doubts that they are pulling our leg, but seriously consider it as a possibility.

DeepO

[Aeson]

I don't want to put up research until after GoW offers the cash. We stand to be left out to dry if we do... "Oops...we'll send it next turn...sorry you don't have the cash you need to upgrade your warriors" isn't something we should leave room for.

[DeepO]

BTW, ever considered that Vox could have gotten a contract on us? GoW could 'honorably' deceive us, if they had a former agreement with Vox in place. One such agreement might include monotheism, and an extra city.

In this case, a contract could be simply a large payment of gold, although it seems unlikely that GoW, who claim to be low on cash, would give that to Vox.

DeepO

[Shiber]

No iron, no riders.
GoW doesn't have iron connected at the moment, right? The iron source that they're referring to is the one adjacent to Thordoba. Should we become concerned about this, we can always stall trading away iron.

[DeepO]

Well, ND has 2 irons (1 connected), and a road connection to GoW. Add to that that 1 turn would be enough for GoW... things might not be as they seem.

DeepO

[Shiber]

I take it that we will wait until our 24 hours expire before we make the final decision. I will be asleep by then, so someone else would have to send the message to GoW.

[Aeson]

Can we even get it in 2 turns? We turned off research last turn. I think it's 3 turns.

I don't like the deal GoW is offering anyways. GF either doesn't understand the game or is just trying to rattle you. WC's destroy Immortals in the flats shield for shield better than Pikes.

[DeepO]

Just read the log, and as always with GoW chats, I didn't like the tone of it. Maybe best that I missed most of it, this hammering really enerves me.

They are underestimating us, yes, but they have reason to. But keeping in mind that possibly GoW is fully aware that Vox is only going after us, this deal shoud not go on without further guarantees.

As to using 900 gold for upgrades: not possible, I think. Vox couldn't have gotten 22 warriors before 1200 BC (when they connected their iron). But add another 95 gold from us, minus maps of Bob (btw, I wouldn't be surprised if that WM also made its way to Legoland), and they could very well have had enough cash for some 15 warrior upgrades... more then they have warriors.

DeepO

[Aeson]

Vox was average with us at 1200BC in military power. That means they had about 10 Warriors to upgrade. I think if they had 12 they would have been strong compared to us.

We know 2 Warriors haven't been upgraded, and they've built at least 1 galley 1 Library/Temple, 2 Spears, and a Settler they gave away. Doesn't leave a whole lot of shields for Immortals.

[DeepO]

BTW, it's unlikely that they could have given Vox 225 gold, keep gold for upgrades, and stay on 100% tech. And being on 100% tech is the only way they could possibly discover Feud in 7 turns. If I'm not mistaken, they are about 10 turns into researching it.

Basically, they are deceiving us, I think. Deal extremely carefully!

DeepO

[Shiber]

If this deal goes through, make sure that you mention to GoW that we want to receive their end of the deal (100 cash + 5 gpt) ASAP, and we want the in-game offer to be approved by the time it reaches us - otherwise we can't use the money in time.

[Aeson]

It can't go through if we can't deliver in 2 turns. I don't think we can even at 100% research.

[Aeson]

GoW seems to be willing to do a 10 turn NDA + 100g up front, +5gpt for Feudalism in 3 turns. They are sitting on the save waiting for our answer. They can send us the gold up front.

[DeepO]

100 gold up front + 5 gpt is no compensation for getting it early, on the contrary, it costs us more then the initial 200 gold or 12 gpt, only for getting the money 2 turns in advance. We don't need it military, do we?

Other then that, we need time to get deals with all other teams in that time span, so I vote against it.

However, can we resonably be sure we can finish in 5 turns without help? In that case, I would offer them that, and do the same with all teams. We need a strong eta if we are going to sell this tech.

DeepO

[Aeson]

I agree, it still isn't much of a deal. At least we know we won't have to bind the sale with that sea ROP junk...

I think we should stick to the initial offering. The 2 turn stuff was just a feeler to see if we couldn't profit more by finishing earlier. Since we didn't get a better offer, the longer we delay the better.

Something isn't right about GoW. If they are lying about Vox landing BOB, that almost certainly puts them as a backer of Vox in this war. In that case Feudalism will slip into Vox's hands shortly (they could go as far as to say Vox stole it... as they have the embassy) after GoW gets it I'm thinking, NDA or not.

We can cut off Vox's Iron in about 10 turns I'm thinking. If we can somehow keep Feudalism out of their hands until then things will go so much smoother.