The KOREAN Civilization: Things Every Civ Player Should Know

[YefeiPi]

Holy crap, this thread is still going!

LMAO....God you're so funny. Just because China has 1.2 billion and India has 0.8 billion people it doesn't mean they have a good economy. LOL. God...do they teach THAT over there in Korea? HAHAHA. You're so funny!

BTW, the EU's economy (which can be count as one due to the integration in Europe) is the size of the USA. Therefor China would be #3.

ROFLMAO, you think China's economy is weak? Are you joking, even at its current stage, its GDP is world's second largest. Need I to mention it's still growing at a freaky rate? That is why U.S is very worried about China because its growth (not in population that is) in all areas. I don't know know about the Indian's economy and I don't care.

Also, Mark L, when you say just because China has 1.2 billion people, it doesn't mean they have a good economy? What kind of logic is that? You are messed up in the head I think! When you have population that large, of course it will be harder for people to find jobs! I mean it's not like tiny European nations with small population where are even left over jobs for immigrants to fill up! When a nation is large (land and population), it is naturally more difficult to manage economically.

[YefeiPi]

Oh BTW, learn to spell Netherlands. You get it wrong every time.

People spell the way they like it, I mean it's not like you don't mispell things. Who would know how to NETHERLANDS anyway?

[Saint Marcus]

Also, Mark L, when you say just because China has 1.2 billion people, it doesn't mean they have a good economy? What kind of logic is that? You are messed up in the head I think!

Let me take three of the world's top 10 in size of GDP. China, India and Brazil. Extreme poverty of millions of people, extreme unemployement, low GDP per capita, millions of people starving to death, millions of people living in slums (like Rio), high crime rates, etc. Some of these examples apply more to one country than the other, but all in all it is rediculous to say that these countries have a good economy, or at least, an economy better than, say, Canada. That completely rediculous! How can Third World countries with such extreme poverty among millions of people can be considered having some of the world's best economies. That's just too stupid for words. The only reason they are high on the list is because of their massive populations, and not because of their economic achievenemts. Anyone saying China, India and Brazil have a better or equal economy to Canada, Germany or Great Britain must be totally insane.

[yin26]

Where in any of this have I said "Good Economy"? Hmmm? Can you not tell the difference between the words "Good" and "Largest"? One is about quality (per capita) while the other is about quantity (in relation to the world). One is of LOCAL importance while the other is of GLOBAL importance. So quit talking about local issues when we are talking about global influence, eh?

And by the way, per capita is a simple measure gained by dividing by the number of people in a nation. Thus, if you have very few, the number is higher. But how does that AT ALL correlate to that nations importance to the outside world? It doesn't. Period.

Further, that number does not mean that each person sees that amount of money on average. A nation like Kuwait sees a vast majority of the money in very, very few hands. Yet, this is not relfected in per capita. Nor are the internal facilities and services offered to the nation's citizens.

As you see, it is much easier for a tiny nation to provide for its people and have a great per capita rating. That rating in terms of world importance is MEANINGLESS! The city of Seoul by itself has 1/3 more people than the ENTIRE population of the Netherlands! LOL!

Now I ask you, the loss of which market would hurt the world more? The loss of China's or the loss of Holland's? If you sat all the world's businessmen down at a table and said: "O.K. We have to decide which country to eliminate from the map -- China or Holland?" -- which would they erase? We all know that answer.

We are not debating how the average Chinese person lives vs. how the average person from the Netherlands lives, are we? We are talking about relative importance TO THE WORLD, and the size of a nations economy (NOT its per capita rating) is a major indicator.

Again, even lowly S.Korea is more economically important to the world than Holland, despite the fact that the average person living in Holland probably has an easier lifestyle, although I understand that its overly liberal policies has made it attractive for people simply NOT to work but instead live off the government (well, this happens in the U.S. as well).

Here's an illustration of just how silly the per capita point is:

There is a man who bought an abandoned oil rig [EDIT: I finally found the background story and posted it below] in international waters. Not so interesting, right? Well (and I don't know the technicalities of this), he was able to declare himself a nation. Yes, he is the president (or did he call himself Prime Minister? I can't recall) of his one-man nation. He has a national flag and is, indeed, a nation.

Now, what he does on this rig is quite interesting: He has somehow managed to hookup a server in his rig and offers an interesting service. You can probably quess: His nation will host ANY website with ANY contents! So people who have a hard time hosting Nazi websites, or bestiality websites, or anything you can imagine that is banned everywhere else can contact this man and have their site securely posted on the Net. [EDIT: Turns out they won't do child porn and some other stuff...you can read the link below.]

Now, since he is his own nation, nobody can force him to take the sites down. Ingenious, right? So you might imagine that he can charge some good money for this service, and he does. [EDIT: The story that I linked to below does not show the figures, but it mentions 'millions' in investment, so perhaps that Per Capita will soon be many, many times higher than ANY OTHER NATION ON EARTH?]

Clearly as the leader of such a nation, he must be invited to all the major international meetings! Clearly leaders from every nation in every corner of the world must be calling him for economic advice and perhaps even loan money.

And yet, he is NOT invited to these meetings and the only people who call him are friends, family and Nazi-lovers.

How could this be? How is it that such a nation is ignored and virtually unknown in the world?

[yin26]

Fear this mighty nation and its amazing economy!!!:



Read about how "already, one million dollars has been invested by HavenCo Ltd. to turn it into the ultimate network hub, with more millions on the way" here!

Yes, this mighty Per Capita nation will soon rule the world!!!

[yin26]

Ah, Wired Magazine has the full article here.

"HavenCo will pull in between $50 million and $100 million in profits by the end of its third year in business." Let's see...divided by just a handful of people, what would the per capita be? LOL!

Yes, per capita tells the WHOLE story about a nation's importance to the world. Just think of Sealand. LOL!!!

[Saint Marcus]

Where in any of this have I said "Good Economy"? Hmmm?

Can't you READ?? Scroll up a bit if your short term memory fails you.

So quit talking about local issues when we are talking about global influence, eh?

Let me see...if Korea ceased to exist nobody would notice. If Holland would cease to exist Europe would certainly notice! Holland is the mainport of Europe, it's not irreplacable (I wouldn't go that far), but it certainly has quite an impact on the economy of the EU.

That rating in terms of world importance is MEANINGLESS!

Well, to take your example, the USA and it's allies did start (or at least enter) a war because of Kuwait. More than they'd do for most of this world's countries.

The city of Seoul by itself has 1/3 more people than the ENTIRE population of the Netherlands! LOL!

I seriously doubt Seoul has 21.3 million citizens. You're pulling facts right out of your ass.

Now I ask you, the loss of which market would hurt the world more? The loss of China's or the loss of Holland's? If you sat all the world's businessmen down at a table and said: "O.K. We have to decide which country to eliminate from the map -- China or Holland?" -- which would they erase? We all know that answer.

If you'd ask an average American they'd probably say China! Business or no business, many countries in the world would be more than happy to see China be eliminated.

Anyway, it's a bit silly to compare China to Holland, isn't it. China has 100 times the population of Holland. However, if you'd ask the same question and replace Holland with Germany, I know China would lose. They all prefer Germany, eventhough it's GDP is smaller than China's.

We are talking about relative importance TO THE WORLD, and the size of a nations economy (NOT its per capita rating) is a major indicator.

China's importance in the world also relies on it's armed forces. Furthermore, I don't think China is the second most important country in the world, eventhough it has the second highest GDP.

Again, even lowly S.Korea is more economically important to the world than Holland, despite the fact that the average person living in Holland probably has an easier lifestyle,

although I understand that its overly liberal policies has made it attractive for people simply NOT to work but instead live off the government (well, this happens in the U.S. as well).

You're a troll Yin. You clearly know jack about Dutch politics and laws.

You can probably quess: His nation will host ANY website with ANY contents! So people who have a hard time hosting Nazi websites, or bestiality websites, or anything you can imagine that is banned everywhere else can contact this man and have their site securely posted on the Net. [EDIT: Turns out they won't do child porn and some other stuff...you can read the link below.]

Bestiality is legal in various countries (including Holland). Nazi websites are legal in various countries too (including the USA).

Clearly as the leader of such a nation, he must be invited to all the major international meetings! Clearly leaders from every nation in every corner of the world must be calling him for economic advice and perhaps even loan money.

I seriously doubt it is internationally recognised as being an independend country. You are becoming more and more ignorant with every post you make. Especcially on your comment on dutch "overly liberal policies". In one of your earlier posts you said you'd do research before talking about a nation. Well, you clearly didn't. You are so full of **** Yin. If I'm a troll, you are certainly one too.

How could this be? How is it that such a nation is ignored and virtually unknown in the world?

It isn't officially recognised as being an independent country. Simple

Yes, per capita tells the WHOLE story about a nation's importance to the world. Just think of Sealand. LOL!!!

Yes, total GDP tells the WHOLE story about a nation's importance to the world. Just think of the slums in Rio. Ever seen pictures of that? Hmmm...and how about the massive amounts of IMf payments flowing to...say India and Korea?

So Mr.Korean-pride-troll, please do some research before commenting on things you clearly don't understand. "Overly liberal policies". LOL. You're a real Troll Yin, though I have to congratulate you on not using that word yourself in not one, but two(!!) of your latest posts. Impressive indeed. So following your glorious example I will not use the word Troll either after this post (eventhough you clearly are a troll).

[yin26]

Let me see...if Korea ceased to exist nobody would notice.

Even YOU must feel stupid after saying that. 1) I never said the end of Holland would go unnoticed, did I? 2) You're just pathetic to even make such a claim. Sad.

Well, to take your example, the USA and it's allies did start (or at least enter) a war because of Kuwait.

For oil, man. For oil.

I seriously doubt Seoul has 21.3 million citizens. You're pulling facts right out of your ass.

You are such a lamer it's not even funny. Not only has this question already been answered...a, Jesus, here it is for you again. Will you admit YOU are talking out of your ass?:

Name Country Est.
population
(in millions)
1. Tokyo Japan 34.5
2. New York USA 21.4
3. Seoul South Korea 20.3
4. Mexico City Mexico 19.3
5. Bombay (Mumbai) India 19.0

Business or no business, many countries in the world would be more than happy to see China be eliminated.

LOL! Pathetic...

It isn't officially recognised as being an independent country. Simple.

Hey, lamer...did you even read the article?

and how about the massive amounts of IMf payments flowing to...say India and Korea?

Um, Korea already paid that off, Troll. Of course, I can't expect you to know that because it's hard to study anything when the head is stuck up a dark place.

As for the liberal policies, I am only sharing what the world says of your country. Do you or do you not have a great deal of social welfare programs in place? Answer the question, you liberal Troll.

[yin26]

By the way, quote me exactly where I say Korea's econ is "better" or "good" -- I have said several times that Korea's econ is #13 in size and, therefore, more important to the world than, say, Holland at #22.

But if you can't makes arguments based on what I actually say, you can always make stuff up, right? And just in case you do find some odd place where I used such a word, I have consistently been arguing about the SIZE of the economy.

Only a troll would say otherwise...thus, troll away.

[yin26]

I'd suggest you write to this site and have them remove this slander immediately! LOL!

http://travel.dk.com/wdr/NL/mNL_Poli.htm

Depite cutbacks in the 1980s, the Dutch still had one of Europe's most generous welfare systems. Most political parties accepted that levels of welfare could not be maintained indefinitely. The debate thus focuses on how much and in which areas cuts should be made.

Costly welfare system, resulting in high taxes and social insurance premiums; one-third of national income spent on social security.

[yin26]

lib¡¤er¡¤al: marked by generosity

...because I know the library is closed, lazy Troll...

[Kenobi]

Ah, patriotism: "last refuge of the scoundrel".

Yin and MarkL, please step back for a minute and try to consider objectively what you are arguing about: "Netherlands vs. Korea, which is more important?" Given your example I'm tempted to start up a new thread matching off Belgium and Venezuela.

Participating in this thread is like watching a fight between two spotty kids fighting over whose dad is tougher - terribly important for the protagonists, sadly ridiculous for the observer.

[yin26]

Actually, this is just me giving a guy from the Netherlands a sorely needed education on a broad range of topics. He doesn't go to the library much because he has no interest in Asia and God knows what other parts of the non-European world, so I might be his best path toward enlightenment.

He might hate me, but secretly he sees in me intellectual salvation. Give him some time. He seems to be running out of places to hide, and THAT'S when the real education will begin.

BTW: I am NOT a Korean patriot. I am American. But I will not let ignorant lies try to beat back obvious and accepted facts. Heck, he's even ignorant about his own coutry, telling me to look up facts that I already looked up just so I can post them to his face.

It's kind of funny, you know...of course I know he's just trolling.

[Saint Marcus]

For oil, man. For oil.

Of course for oil, but that doesn't change a thing. Kuwait, for whatever reason, is considered important enough to fight a war over. Can't say the same about a lot of other countries in this world.

You are such a lamer it's not even funny. Not only has this question already been answered...a, Jesus, here it is for you again. Will you admit YOU are talking out of your ass?:

Name Country Est.
population
(in millions)
1. Tokyo Japan 34.5
2. New York USA 21.4
3. Seoul South Korea 20.3
4. Mexico City Mexico 19.3
5. Bombay (Mumbai) India 19.0

Thanks for pulling these "facts" out of the depths of your ass. Mexico City is quite a bit larger than Seoul and I think NY and Tokyo too.

As for the liberal policies, I am only sharing what the world says of your country. Do you or do you not have a great deal of social welfare programs in place? Answer the question, you liberal Troll.

1. The liberals in Holland are AGAINST social welfare programs
2. Social Support (bijstand), the lowest level of welfare, is too low for people to live on. In other words, it doesn't create people that are too lazy to work. And yeah, there are other welfare benefits you can get, but you first have to work for that and pay money to the governement, who in turn will give you money should something happen. But it's not free money...no way. Only Social Support is, and that's too low for people to live on. So besides a quote of a few lines you didn't do ANY research.

Actually, this is just me giving a guy from the Netherlands a sorely needed education on a broad range of topics.

Broad range? It's all about Korean pride.

He doesn't go to the library much

Everyday now that school has started again. Trying to get some sources on the Humean predicament now. You know, books written by Hume and Quine. And don't come telling me now that you don't know what the Humean predicament is...it's an important principle in both philosophy and science. So please, stop your trolling and try to read some quality reading. I doubt you've ever read a single book of any of the great philosophers.

By the way, quote me exactly where I say Korea's econ is "better" or "good"

Did it several times already. Just scroll up. Don't be so lazy.

BTW: I am NOT a Korean patriot. I am American

That makes no sense at all. If you live in the USA and have the American nationality, you can still be a Korean patriot because of your heritage. You're really not making sense.

He might hate me

Why would I hate you? I think stupidity is an excuse...at least in this case. You can't help it...just the way you are.

[Ribannah]

Originally posted by yin26

"Despite cutbacks in the 1980s, the Dutch still had one of Europe's most generous welfare systems. Most political parties accepted that levels of welfare could not be maintained indefinitely. The debate thus focuses on how much and in which areas cuts should be made."
"Costly welfare system, resulting in high taxes and social insurance premiums; one-third of national income spent on social security."

This sounds like right-wing propaganda. The quality of Dutch social security has by now sunk to mediocre, compared to European standards, despite scientific studies that showed that the high quality reached in the late 70's could have been maintained without any bad economic effects.
The national income can, by definition, not be "spent" on social benefits. Social insurance merely redistributes the national income and has no primary effect on the purchasing power of the population as a whole.