To Mikes or Not to Mikes

[StrategicKingMi]

Please tell me what you can do in Communism that you cant do in fundy? Nobody has answered that question yet. Communism sucks.

[StrategicKingMi]

Also, the most cost effective unit is only available to a fundy government and that is fanatics at 20 resources each.

[Smash]

well you can build vet spys for one.

I suggest you re-examine Communism.If you think Fundy is good then you will grow to love what can be done with Communism

How does a corruption free Republic with no Senate inteference and no science penalty sound?

[atawa]

I'd have to agree with Smash here, spies are much more cost effective then fanatics.

[rah]

Playing all the MP, I've gotten out of the habit of having mics. If it gets handed to me, I'll build it. But usually I'd rather shoot for sol for early communism. With a little celebrating the science is quite good and the extra production helps building the caravans to make the difference.

[StrategicKingMi]

The game rarely gets to spies first off. Even if it does, vet spies are a small advantage over non-vet spies. Now as far as the ONLY other advantage, your tech rate not being halfed. I must stress this, if your science % is over 20% after you get trade, you are being wastefull. To be full effecient, 90% of beakers should be produced by caravans and caravans ONLY! For a 50 resource unit, you can produce 200 beakers of tech not to mention 8-16 extra trade per turn. In terms of gold, the cost, assuming a city that produces 10 resources a turn, is 75 gold and 2 turns of production. Thus you profit from a van, 125 gold and 200 beakers of tech. When your science rate is high, 75 trade that goes to science, is still , any way you slice it, 75 beakers. But if, instead of science, 75 trade goes to taxes. Then you can get 200 beakers and 200 gold. Why on Earth would you want to still keep your science rate over 20%?
Bad supply and demand? Then keep taxes high and start plunking down 1 person citys and see what the supply and demand is. With good supply and demand, now build 2 more settlers into that city and start trading with it.
Again, there is nothing you can do in Communism that you cant accomplish in Fundy.

[Dank]

His thinking is made very clear after playing some test games by myself........I must agree that with the trade working for ya at it's fullest advantage why would you need to keep science high....no reason

[Smash]

well it you aren't getting to Espionage for spys then you ain't getting to Fundalmentalism to get fanatics(No fanatics just from SoL)

The Commie civ will be delivering camels also..duh..probably for higher bonus as well.Big difference is the Commie can also generate trade arrows much better than the Fundy civ.I get my tech from camels and I get another one on raw beakers.

I've always found Fundy more of government for the beginner.

[DrFell]

Unless you deliberately avoid navigation and invention, the caravan bonus is going to drop considerably unless you have absolutely huge cities. I'd be suprised if you can get 200 gold every caravan, delivering enough caravans for 1 tech per turn all game. Hard enough to do even if you have an ally.

[StrategicKingMi]

Again, I posted on this as well. Apearently you were not paying attention. Trade routes are progressive. you do not get half when you get navigation and invention. The pot is just reset and you must work your way back to where you were before. After delivering a few below average pay offs, the payoffs will get back to where they were before. I get 500 + bonus routes from trading with other civs long after i got both invention and navigation. These routes do not normally pay 1000 gold, so the theory of half payoffs is shot completely out of the water.
As far as fundy being for a rookie, if you are keeping your science rate that high, then your the rookie, or you are playing with bad players that will let you get away with that. if i get to fundy. you will be fighting an extremely agresive 200 + unit army. The only way to respond to it, is with a 200+ unit army of your own, and since you will take casulties every turn numbering in the many hundreds, if not thousands of resources, the only way to replace them is to buy them, which requires gold which equals gold from taxes and gold from routes. And go ahead, try to do 2 techs a turn, before you can gain any advantage from them, i will steal them and thankyou for them with many dead units of yours.

[Smash]

ok I see it all now.I should know better than to question the greatest player ever.
You seem to have a different version than mine.Good thing I didn't waste your time with a game.

[Eyes_Of_Night]

Guys you can't argue with the 8 time gameleague champion. I mean come on, he's been at number 1 on gameleague 8 times!! That's a total of 23 hours at number 1!!! That's amazing!

[War4ever]

LOL @ EYES......Strat you make it sound like you can do this every game....impossible even for the greatest players to do every game....keep in mind that while your trying to perfect this strategy, some of us will be knocking on your door with troops , caravans, dips of our own....

while i don't doubt that what you say can be accomplished by playing on the world map in SP mode , i question you being able to do this on tiny rock worlds on a continuous basis during mp

[Alexander's Horse]

If you want to see the value of wonders, play a duel at deity level with no wonders. Markusf and I just did that. It means cities almost permanently in disorder, almost impossible to stay in democracy. Huge corruption and production losses even in monarchy during the expansion phase etc. etc. Its really challenging.

[markusf]

Originally posted by Alexander's Horse
If you want to see the value of wonders, play a duel at deity level with no wonders. Markusf and I just did that. It means cities almost permanently in disorder, almost impossible to stay in democracy. Huge corruption and production losses even in monarchy during the expansion phase etc. etc. Its really challenging.

bs. It was your **** map,only being able to build size 3 cities and the fact i was fielding 4 crusaders a city in republic.

Strat is an idiot, he can't accomplish any of what he says in a mp game, and has to resort to playing newbies who don't know that he takes a half hour for a turn. Hell he still hasn't figured out that demand goods mean absolutely nothing, and how to reset routes.