To Mikes or Not to Mikes

[StrategicKingMi]

I had an interesting conversation the other day. I had a big lead in a 4 way game and one of the contestants said I sould have built Mikes. But as I posted earlier, in 2 x 2 king, wonders are obsolete, here is why Mikes is obsolete.
Simply put, Mikes is way too expensive to build.
The cost of Mikes is as follows: 2 techs(poly and mono) which equals 1500 beakers..next 8 caravans which properly turned into routes will yeild 1900 gold and 1900 beakers. Thus the total cost is 3400 beakers and 1900 gold.
Now if you build 20 temples and 20 markets the resource cost of this is 120 x 20 = 2400. By raising taxes, you can convert the 1500 beakers that you save from not going for Mikes to gold yeilding 3400 gold or 1700 resources. Thus the cost of 20 markets and 20 temples is 700 resources or 1400 gold. Thoose 8 routes will yeild 12 additional trade bonus at 5 each = 60 per turn which at 50 tax per turn will pay 400 of that 1400 in 10 turns. The markets will pay ( from a city with three bonus and 7 people) 14 gold per turn each or 280 or in 10 turns 2800 gold. Thus you make about 180 gold a turn profit. Not to mention that the extra bonus in your citys will help your citys celebrate much easier.
After the 10 turns, now you earn expotentially.
Mikes in a 40 city civ does not really give you much more of an advantage then a temple + a market does. If you decompartmentalize your citys, in otherwise make 10 citys (never growing more then 3) produce settlers. Another 10 producing ships and units and not growing. Then that leaves you your 20 citys that trade with one another. And sine 20 citys are kept small, mikes is uneeded as it is surpurfalas.

[SlowwHand]

What is surpurfalas?

[Smash]

what happens when all those temples and markets get sabotaged?

[winzity]

Of course you don't need Mikes if you play King. Wonders are for Deity players...

[StrategicKingMi]

Well, most players dont sabatge citys. And even if they do, they will still have to get there with at least 3 diplomats per city. As the first eliminates the production, lets say 20 resources, then the temple which is 40 resources, thats 60 resources or the exact cost of 2 diplos. The third one really hurts, 80 for 30. Good Luck getting 3 diplos to my citys.

[StrategicKingMi]

Oh, and by the way, my mathmatical equation works even better on 1 x 1 deity as trade routes will still produce decent revenue and you have far fewer citys.

[Smash]

A dip will always sabotage at least 40 sheilds unless nothing else is left.30 invested.At least 40 sabotaged not to mention the effects of removing infastructure.Its also very demoralizing.I don't know what most players do,but I sabotage like crazy.

Getting 3 dips in is no problem.More like 30 most likely.


If you had a chance for Michs you should take it.Take em all if you can

[atawa]

I'd rather spend my 400 shields on statue then mike's, with temples/markets and routes in every major city its not hard to get the same tech in commie.

Besides, you eliminate corruption and get a free 3 unit support per city witch by then should be at least another 75 shields per turn.

[DrFell]

You're forgetting that if you're guaranteed such high payoffs as 1900 gold, you can BUY mikes for 1600 or less gold, or buy caravans in cities with no good trade commodities and send those to build it (which is even cheaper, about 125 gold per caravan, 8 caravans are 1000 gold). Then you have the cost of having your lux so high, which is taking away sci and tax every single turn. When you get mikes and theology, you can celebrate your cities up to maximum size, ever new city has a free cathedral in it no matter how corrupt it is, and when you get your cities up to size you turn down the lux to 0. And don't forget that few people build temples etc. until late on, so it's good to have the wonder simply to take away from an opponent.

In true strate style, here's an example of how it should be done, bear in mind I was fighting a two front war against the Americans and Spanish early on, and this was an early 4-way of mine where I was still trying out strats, which is why I don't have steam engine right now. I am the celts in this one:

[StrategicKingMi]

You are forgetting Fell, that you must have the tech before you can buy mikes. And against good players that means you will probably lose Mageleons which is far more important thn mikes is.

[DrFell]

The lux saved from having 0% lux rate can go into science, which will get you to navigation quicker after you build mike's anyway.

[atawa]

But with the sience from the 8 caravans AND without the 2 extra techs you'll get there a lot sooner

[StrategicKingMi]

Also, you cant celebrate with 0 lux.
By the by, communism really sucks. There is nothing you can do in a communistic government that you cant do in fundy. And there are many things you can do in fundy you cant do in commie.
1) celebrate easier cause of no unhappiness.
2) virtually no support for any units.
Now, if you are concerned about the draw back which is half tech. Then just deliver caravans exclusively for tech. Science rates too high are why most players lose to me now as after trade I rarely go above 20%. Can others say that?

[DrFell]

All you need is 3 warriors in a communist city and you can support a size 9 city on king (and there is no riot factor). So I don't see why you hate communism so much.

And you do the celebrating in 'batches' ceebrate up as many cities as you can in one go then turn the lux down as far as you can handle (hopefully back down to 0).

[rah]

Yes, people sometimes underestimate the power of Communism. If you get skunked on all the happiness wonders, it's a great alternative. You can develop sciences every two turns (not including caravans) and the batch celebrating the Dr mentioned is quite effective.

RAH